Posts by borgfree

21

JW Bro-in law dies

by borgfree in

jw
friends

sunday my brother-in-law, loyd gardiner, died.

he was an elder in the richmond, indiana congregation for about 50 years.. my son and i are having real problems deciding what to do.

we had decided not to go to the services because almost everyone there will be jws and we do not see the need to expose ourselves to the rude treatment by them.. i got a phone message last night from someone, not baptized jw, who thought we should go to the viewing today, to show "our respects".

borgfree

I want to give an update on what happened last night.

Somehow I got the information wrong. The viewing was from 5:00PM to 9:00PM.

When Allen and I arrived at the funeral home, at 7:00, Allen suggested we have a prayer before going in. Good idea.

We walked past one of my daughters and her husband, standing outside talking to some other people (probably family) we of course, were invisible. As we got to the door about 20 30 people were coming out the door, so we politely stood to one side. As they filed out we looked each one in the eye, we were still invisible.

Inside there were (est.) 100 people, maybe more. We held our heads up, as Nancy suggested. Two or three looked at us as we passed, and I spoke to the ones who actually saw us. A couple of them very quietly spoke back.

In the large room, two family members, who are not JWs, met us; they stayed beside us the entire time we were there. I thanked them for their great support; they, for being with us, were not treat very well.

From that point on, I wish you all could have seen the whole crowd. Whenever I looked around the room, I would see two or three people talking together looking at us, (staring actually) then when they saw me look in their direction they immediately turned away. There were people seated all around the room, at the walls. Some had stern looks on their faces, you got the feeling they were the enforcers/squealers.

Allen and I agreed that our prayer was really being answered as we both had a great time. We were calm, no feeling of intimidation, we just looked at those poor people, how controlled their lives are, we said, these are adults, what strange behavior for adult, thinking people realizing that we had been that way ourselves when we believed that nonsense

My sister came to where we were standing and gave us a hug. A few other family members also came to us, one by one, and hugged us. Three of my daughters did not. We were not there, to them.

Several, who came to us to give us a hug, surprised me; they were ones I thought would ignore us. We stayed about an hour, then as we were leaving, two or three more rushed out to give us a hug, before we went out the door.

There is so much I would like to say about that experience but I do not know how to put the feelings and atmosphere into words. I will just say I am so glad we went. You all were right; it was the right thing to do.

And, Grace, we did sign the book, Ha! We had a small audience while we signed it.

Thanks again for all of your encouragement.

Borgfree

21

JW Bro-in law dies

by borgfree in

jw
friends

sunday my brother-in-law, loyd gardiner, died.

he was an elder in the richmond, indiana congregation for about 50 years.. my son and i are having real problems deciding what to do.

we had decided not to go to the services because almost everyone there will be jws and we do not see the need to expose ourselves to the rude treatment by them.. i got a phone message last night from someone, not baptized jw, who thought we should go to the viewing today, to show "our respects".

borgfree

Hi all.

I was going to take a personal day off work today as Allen and I decided we would go to the viewing at 7:00PM, the viewing is 7:00 9:00 PM, but, I must have payroll done and into our district office today. So, I needed to go to work for a few hours. I want to take a few minutes to thank you all. It has been a difficult morning and your comments were so helpful and appreciated.

Thanks

Robdar thank you for such kind words.

Simon I agree with what you said.

TR thank you.

LB yes, I agree, it is never a pleasant experience, I hope we may do some good just by being there.

Nathan thanks, my thoughts are more for the living.

Pettygrudger you are right. I hope our being there has the effect you mention. I think our obligation is to show the love of the One we follow. Our feelings need to take a back seat to that.

Nancy thank you so much for your kind thoughts. We do not intend to stand for a lot of abuse. We hope to be a surprise to them, that we, who leave the Borg, can show more love than their JW friends.

Brummie thank you for your thoughts. I admire your courage and how you handled your situation.

ELS thank you. We will try to express our condolences, I am not sure some will be receptive, but we can try.

Grace thanks very much. You are right about the feelings; there will probably be many JWs there. I do not look forward to it, but we have decided it is the right thing to do. Everyone here has helped in that decision. We will make a special effort to sign the book.

Golden Girl thank you. I do not think they are still a part of my life, but I have hope that something we may do or say may start them to thinking. I am sorry for your situation. I know how you feel, I do not want to hear any more of the garbage from the JW speakers, I heard all of that I ever want to hear already.

LovesDubs thanks I also believe we have a soul. I do not know where he is now, but I agree with you, he now knows he was in a destructive cult. I will do my best to follow your advice.

Much love to you all.

Borgfree

21

JW Bro-in law dies

by borgfree in

jw
friends

sunday my brother-in-law, loyd gardiner, died.

he was an elder in the richmond, indiana congregation for about 50 years.. my son and i are having real problems deciding what to do.

we had decided not to go to the services because almost everyone there will be jws and we do not see the need to expose ourselves to the rude treatment by them.. i got a phone message last night from someone, not baptized jw, who thought we should go to the viewing today, to show "our respects".

borgfree

Thanks everyone, I really appreciate your input.

I am thinking mainly of my sister.

Nathan, no, I sincerely doubt that he would have attended my funeral, if it had been the reverse situation. He has had Alzheimer's disease for the past several years, the last time I saw him, about 4 years ago, he did not remember that I was an "apostate" and when he saw me his face lit up with a big smile and was telling my sister something, while pointing at me, he was really happy to see me. Someone soon talked to him and calmed him down. That is my last memory of him.

I agree with most of you that, being a Christian, I should show the love we should have.

Nancy, I do not intend to allow myself to go through that kind of treatment, and co-operate with it. We will, as you said, hold our heads up in dignity and let them see we are not "out there somewhere in darkness"

I will not take time to address each of you personally, but, I thank everyone of you for your good wishes, thoughts, and advise, you are the best.

Borgfree

21

JW Bro-in law dies

by borgfree in

jw
friends

sunday my brother-in-law, loyd gardiner, died.

he was an elder in the richmond, indiana congregation for about 50 years.. my son and i are having real problems deciding what to do.

we had decided not to go to the services because almost everyone there will be jws and we do not see the need to expose ourselves to the rude treatment by them.. i got a phone message last night from someone, not baptized jw, who thought we should go to the viewing today, to show "our respects".

borgfree

Sunday my brother-in-law, Loyd Gardiner, died. I think some of you know him. He was an elder in the Richmond, Indiana congregation for about 50 years.

My son and I are having real problems deciding what to do. We had decided not to go to the services because almost everyone there will be JWs and we do not see the need to expose ourselves to the rude treatment by them.

I got a phone message last night from someone, not baptized JW, who thought we should go to the viewing today, to show "our respects"

I am thinking, right now, that we will go this evening. I must say, I do not want to go. I have been in this position before. Last year my oldest sister died, she was a JW in her youth, but stopped having anything to do with the organization many years ago. All of my JW family were there, they congregated on the other side of the room talking etc. while I sat on the other side of the room, by myself.

My thoughts are, that we should show that we care, and think of them, even though they do not return the sentiments.

I welcome any comments.

Borgfree

9

new religion?

by freddi in

jw
friends

hey all,.

has anyone ever ventured into that world that witnesses call christendom once they stopped attending the kingdom hall?.

i know that i have returned to "my own vomit" as j.w.

borgfree

Hi Freddi,

I have gone to several religions. I have enjoyed the Pentecostals the most because of the music and worship. I think I like the Baptist teaching the most, they seem to be solid in bible teaching.

Borgfree

8

MUSLIM APOCALYPSE DANGER

by Bhagavad in

jw
friends

looks like the big threat to the world now is by muslims who maybe had read too many watchtowers in addition to the koran....... .

http://www.newsmax.com

"saudi connection to 9/11 revealed.

borgfree

Kind of like the "Christian" crusaders, huh? Yep those darn fanatical muslims sure do have a franchise on stupidity!

I do not see where there is a comparison.

At no time did the founder or leader of Christianity (Jesus Christ) tell His followers to do the things done in the crusades or inquisitions, etc. Nor is that conduct taught in the Christian scriptures (NT)

To compare people doing unchristian acts in the name of Christianity to Muslims doing what their founder told them to do in the Qur'an is not a legitimate comparison.

Borgfree

101

Americans?

by MrMoe in

jw
friends

thanks, americans, that really nice of you.

englishman.. this statement lead me to thinking something.

i am not posting this to argue, cause a flame war, or the like.

borgfree

Og,

I am leaving for work so I will make this short, for now.

Your statement:

You idiot. We live off them. Our food system, for example, depends on cheap labor by undocumented workers. All of our goods and our cheap oil depend on systematic oppression of weaker countries.

When did these super-laborers come to this country? How on earth did we survive while we were waiting for them to sneak over our borders and save us? It has been claimed, on this board, that the country was built on the backs of slaves, which is it? slaves or migrant workers who built this country?

And, BTW, if they could build this country into the greatest super-power the world has ever known, why did they not stay home and build their own countries into a world power instead of them still being third world countries?

There are many such questions, but, you can think of them for yourself, if, you can get past the indoctrination of the socialists/communists who have taught you in our disgraceful school system.

In the mean time, I will suffer with poverty and still deport all illegal aliens.

Borgfree

101

Americans?

by MrMoe in

jw
friends

thanks, americans, that really nice of you.

englishman.. this statement lead me to thinking something.

i am not posting this to argue, cause a flame war, or the like.

borgfree

Og,

You do not know what you are talking about and all of your name calling and/or four letter words will not change that.

Borgfree

101

Americans?

by MrMoe in

jw
friends

thanks, americans, that really nice of you.

englishman.. this statement lead me to thinking something.

i am not posting this to argue, cause a flame war, or the like.

borgfree

I guess at this point, I wish the US would become isolationist. I would like our government to deport all of the illegal aliens; they come over our borders by the millions, living off of the workers of this country,

I would like our military to guard our borders, to stop any further invasion of our country. I would like for our best military designers to continue to build the most powerful and effective weapons possible. I would like to withdraw all of our troops, equipment, missiles, satellite access, etc. from the entire world.

Now, the world, which loves to hate the US, could deal with the dictators, terrorists, and madmen, anyway they choose, just do not mess with us.

If, after these steps were taken, any country, power, or force targets us with missiles or threatens us in any way, we destroy their capabilities forever, using whatever force is necessary to accomplish the task.

After we are no longer involved in world matters, the world can handle their problems as they choose, they can attack each other, nuke each other, overthrow governments of other countries, mass murder, commit all of the terrorist acts they choose, just do not bring the US into it or threaten the US, or God help you.

Borgfree

101

Americans?

by MrMoe in

jw
friends

thanks, americans, that really nice of you.

englishman.. this statement lead me to thinking something.

i am not posting this to argue, cause a flame war, or the like.

borgfree

The interests of America are the interests of the world.

Didn't I read that somewhere?

Borgfree

America is a large, friendly dog in a very small room. Every time it wags its tail, it knocks over a chair.
Arnold Toynbee (1889 - 1975)

Edited by - borgfree on 20 November 2002 18:20:33