slimboyfat, it appears that wts is going, gone digital.
can you show your view what is wts next move after they are completely gone from kings county and settled in warwick?
- this thread is your if you want it..
That's interesting, where do you get a figure for attendance at general conference? Mormons I was talking to told me they sometimes watch general conference at home on the television. They don't necessarily need to go to church.
Which makes me wonder actually. Are people listening on the phone counted as attending the memorial these days I wonder?
slimboyfat, it appears that wts is going, gone digital.
can you show your view what is wts next move after they are completely gone from kings county and settled in warwick?
- this thread is your if you want it..
To put it even more dramatically, even the 20 million who attended the JW memorial are more active than the inactive "members" of the Mormon church, the majority of whom never attend a Mormon church at all.
The Mormon church counts every single person who has ever been baptised as a member of the church, regardless of whether they attend or whether they still believe in the church. Mormons can only be removed from the membership total if they write a letter to the church renouncing membership, which relatively few ever do. If you stop attending church they still count you. If you attend a different church they still count you. If you move and they lose touch with you they still count you. They still count you until you are 115. Only then are you removed from the membership total and presumed likely dead.
slimboyfat, it appears that wts is going, gone digital.
can you show your view what is wts next move after they are completely gone from kings county and settled in warwick?
- this thread is your if you want it..
“The majority of members on church records are inactive or less active. Approximately 30% of worldwide membership was active as of 2012, suggesting that 30% of members attended church regularly and followed most basic church teachings…The ten countries with the most members account for 79% of worldwide membership and experience an average member activity rate of 22%…” –Cumorah.com, Matt Martinich
slimboyfat, it appears that wts is going, gone digital.
can you show your view what is wts next move after they are completely gone from kings county and settled in warwick?
- this thread is your if you want it..
Yes Mormon activity rates average around 30%, making about 4.5 million active members worldwide.
some people believe that stealing, lying and killing, is not moral.
some people don't.. does morality exist?
if so, prove it..
Depends what you mean. Are there absolute moral standards? If there is a God then yes, there may be. If not, then no.
If there are no absolute moral standards is it worth having moral standards at all? Yes I think so. Why should morality need to be absolute in order to be valuable or desirable?
It's like making sand castles. Can we make absolutely perfect sand castles? No we can't. Does that mean there's no point making sand castles at all?
It seems an odd proposition that making sand castles would only be worthwhile if we make absolutely perfect sand castles. Why should building an ethical outlook be any different?
slimboyfat, it appears that wts is going, gone digital.
can you show your view what is wts next move after they are completely gone from kings county and settled in warwick?
- this thread is your if you want it..
I don't hope JWs collapse. What I hope for is that they stop shunning and concentrate on positive aspects of their heritage that people can be proud of.
In terms of growth or decline I am just interested in interesting developments. Until recently I probably had a more positive view of JW growth than many. I think they have done amazingly well to grow as much and as fast as they have. They are much more successful than the Mormons for example. They have been around 50 years less than the Mormons and yet have about twice as many active members. Plus JWs are much more evenly spread across the globe than Mormons.
Watchtower was one of the most, or arguably the most successful publishing organisation the world has ever seen. The Watchtower magazine itself was the highest circulated, most translated, most read, studied and obeyed magazine the world has ever known. Their study books are among the most widely distributed and annotated texts in history. These are amazing achievements, and they did this in the post-war west against the backdrop of declining interest in religion in society in general. Their growth is all the more impressive compared with the sharp declines of other churches over the same period. (I know there are other religious success stories, most prominently the Pentecostals. But frankly that was largely a political phenomenon in South America, and short lived in most other places.)
It's the tremendous success of JWs in the twentieth century that makes their recent reversal all the more striking, and interesting... and for those of us who care, hopeful that certain things may change.
slimboyfat, it appears that wts is going, gone digital.
can you show your view what is wts next move after they are completely gone from kings county and settled in warwick?
- this thread is your if you want it..
I kind of did:
Income in Britain from "literature production" (presumably sales of literature to other branches) has been declining rapidly. (Apparently this is how they count it - one branch pays another branch for literature) The United States, United Kingdom and Germany have all been mass exporters of Watchtower literature in the past. As this declines their surpluses may decline.
slimboyfat, it appears that wts is going, gone digital.
can you show your view what is wts next move after they are completely gone from kings county and settled in warwick?
- this thread is your if you want it..
The "literature sales" are from one branch to another, not to the public. They are a feature of Watchtower management accounting, not a source of revenue.
slimboyfat, it appears that wts is going, gone digital.
can you show your view what is wts next move after they are completely gone from kings county and settled in warwick?
- this thread is your if you want it..
Why the uncertainty about timing of collapse?
Simply because we don't know how much money Watchtower has on hand. We do know they have a revenue problem and there is no apparent solution in sight. So on this trajectory they will run out of money at some point. How long this will take depends on how much money they have in reserve and how skilful they are at managing decline. These things are not easy to determine.
Of course there is also the possibility they will reverse the decline. It's just not easy to see how.
slimboyfat, it appears that wts is going, gone digital.
can you show your view what is wts next move after they are completely gone from kings county and settled in warwick?
- this thread is your if you want it..
Sounds plausible. But I wonder if he meant this year alone, or over a longer period. The financial information publicly available in the UK indicates they have a reasonable cushion of funds at the moment and income covers expenses. It also indicates a high level of spending recent years. It will be interesting to see how this develops in the next few years. Income in Britain from "literature production" (presumably sales of literature to other branches) has been declining rapidly. (Apparently this is how they count it - one branch pays another branch for literature) The United States, United Kingdom and Germany have all been mass exporters of Watchtower literature in the past. As this declines their surpluses may decline. It's all very complicated, but there is information out there that is worth investigating. There must be interested people with the skills to analyse these things.
It's worth bearing in mind that the US, UK, Germany and Brazil combined account for about a quarter of JW membership. If most other countries have a deficit that's not a great position to be in. You might even call it unsustainable.
