Posts by OrphanCrow

63

Nine Seconds that says it all. Have these elders any shame?

by Wasanelder Once in

what can i add?

this says it all.. elder on stand is mute till prompted.. .

i guess i could encourage you to watch to the end and a guest commentary, lol..

OrphanCrow

Barry: I believe the elders are getting a dose of the same medicine they give out to the people under their care in the congregation because in this royal commission they are treated better than the people under them that have suffered as victims

You are absolutely right. FastJehu addresses the same concerns I have - why do the victims and witnesses called before a JW judical hearing not allowed legal representation? The WTS has set up their judical system as though it is a court of law but they don't grant basic human rights to those they are questioning and passing judical judgements on.

Ruby, you have brought up the issue of "fairness'. That is exactly why this Royal Commission has been set up - to invesitigate if instituions are behaving fairly to everybody that they effect with their policies, including the society at large. Who it is that Justice McClelland and the lawyers that question the elders are speaking for - are you, me and everybody else who are citizens of this world. They speak for everybody. They represent us in the broadest sense.

Besides, the JWs who are giving testimony are being treated far more fairly than the WTs treats children - the JWs are allowed legal counsel at this inquiry. Which is ironic - the Commission keeps asking if they provided "counsel" for the victim and the JWs keep thinking that "counsel" means disiplining them according to Biblical principles or providing a "sister' for a shoulder on for crying tears to fill that skin bottle - they don't realize that it means "legal counsel".

36

Those aussie elders may escape repercussions after all....RC day 3

by Witness My Fury in

damn those tricky state laws: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmeg1omfumk 15:30 on.

annoying no?.

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OrphanCrow

The Commission is doing what it set out to do. Expose the inadequacies of legal systems. Both those within the institutions that it is investigating and those in the society at large.

This is a serious inadequacy that the Royal commission has successfully uncovered. Now it can be fixed.

There is more to come. It ain't over til the fat lady sings...the hearing has just started rolling for the JWs. But, they sit within a larger institutional problem - they are only one institution of many being investigated.

That is why changes will occur - they JW institutional policies are not the only ones being investigated. This isn't "oh no! JWs are being singled out for persecution!"

It just so happens that the JW religion is coming out of this inquiry as being woefully inadequate on many different levels.

104

Do you feel vindicated by the exposure of the WT Society in Australia? It seems like a feeding frenzy on here! I love it. You?

by Wasanelder Once in

are you pleased with the exposure of the society in australia?

do you feel personally vindicated by it?

do you think it gives you credibility with others now that all the things you said were going on, actually are documented?

OrphanCrow

Mephis: But the whole process and procedure of their internal judicial structure... they're still hauling people in front of judicial committees to face their abusers in spite of said abusers just being out of prison for those very offences. They need to broaden their evidence requirements. They can do this easily. Their internal letters show that they can re-write the meaning of a word when it suits their needs.

I disagree with this part of your post.

The elders should not be sticking their nose into "evidence collecting". Who made them cops?? Are they a professional police force? Nobody in a religion should be "collecting evidence" on an alleged crime. Mandatory reporting laws or not - sexual abuse of a minor is still a crime.

Not only that, the elders "collecting evidence" system certainly calls into question their claims that they can't release information under the clergy penitent clause. That privlege is violated the minute that the elders start sticking thier nose into evidence collecting. Even the practice of having three elders in the room when said confidential information was exposed is an slippery slope.

If they are so concerned about confidentiality and privacy laws, using those laws as a shield to hide behind, why did the whole congregation that BCG attended know about the abuse? Her confidentiality certainly wasn't respected.

Whatever happened to the fundamental right of legal representation when facing a court system?

104

Do you feel vindicated by the exposure of the WT Society in Australia? It seems like a feeding frenzy on here! I love it. You?

by Wasanelder Once in

are you pleased with the exposure of the society in australia?

do you feel personally vindicated by it?

do you think it gives you credibility with others now that all the things you said were going on, actually are documented?

OrphanCrow

konceptual: Yet on this matter they are so woefully and shamelessly behind the curve they cannot even see the other side of the corner. They refuse to push forward as they don't think they need to. They make no concessions, give no quarter lest they unleash a barrage of liability suits.

The WTS has to stand on their old, outdated judical law. If they started to dismantle the "two witness rule" and those archaic laws they follow, the next big "law" to be challenged would be their blood doctrine that is rooted in that same archaic law book.

Pull the pins out of that archaic Judaic law that they have built their judical system on, and the blood doctrine does a crash and burn.

17

RC on CNN - Damn this is Damning!!!

by jw07 in

even cnn has picked up the ongoing royal commission hearings.

i'm sitting back and eating popcorn for this one, it's like a dream come through.. http://edition.cnn.com/videos/world/2015/07/28/australia-jehovah-witness-sex-abuse-hannigan-lklv.cnn.

OrphanCrow

The Jehovah's Witnesses thrive on controversy. Historically, if they didn't have a crisis to face, they had one created for them. They love being martyrs and the WTS has always given them a "cause" to rise against. This one is a particulary evil cause and one that will not recieve public support.

The WTS likes agitation. They have lost membership before - up to 75% in the 1920s - and, even then, in the 30s, old fat ass Rutherford decided to take on German politics. And, in America in the 30s and 40s, Covington orchestrated the flag slaute and pledge controversy. They deliberately clogged up the court system with that one.

I have already read a comment on one forum (I think it was reddit) where a JW said - "We will go to jail like in WW2 and preach inside the jails." !!!! What an idiotic comment. Jail will not be easy on these jerks - they don't like skinners on the inside.

This time, too, it is going to cost them piles of money. That is going to hurt.

And the public shame will be a hard one to swallow. Pretty soon all the GB will have faces as red as old Bowditch's down in Australia.

7

Jehovah's Witnesses Attorney's Keeping Things Secret

by OrphanCrow in

the person who has made this video has done some pretty good investigation into the watchtower lawyers in ny.. this is a revealing 10 minute watch.

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2zpxxj_jehovah-s-witnesses-attorneys-keeping-things-secret_news.

hmmm...i wonder what he could turn up on boston college?

OrphanCrow

Lol! Well, we do know that all those lawyers are connected to one of the biggest "secret societies" that there is - The Watchtower Society.

Anybody out there have their hands on the list of membership for the WT Society? How transparent is the WTS?

I would call the Watchtower Society "secret".

8

FMF's Apologist's History of Pedophile Related Persecution of the First Century Congregation (with illustrations)

by freemindfade in

.

OrphanCrow

The Two Witness Rule:

Apparently you needed two witnesses to hang Jesus on a stick, too.

Huh..,notice that it didn't work out too well for those two witnesses...

7

Jehovah's Witnesses Attorney's Keeping Things Secret

by OrphanCrow in

the person who has made this video has done some pretty good investigation into the watchtower lawyers in ny.. this is a revealing 10 minute watch.

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2zpxxj_jehovah-s-witnesses-attorneys-keeping-things-secret_news.

hmmm...i wonder what he could turn up on boston college?

OrphanCrow

The person who has made this video has done some pretty good investigation into the Watchtower lawyers in NY.

This is a revealing 10 minute watch.

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2zpxxj_jehovah-s-witnesses-attorneys-keeping-things-secret_news

Hmmm...I wonder what he could turn up on Boston College? That is a university that has many Jehovah's Witness names connected to it.

Zimbabwe: Judgment reserved in Jehovah's Witnesses case

by OrphanCrow in

school, parents in religious row.

29th july 2015. http://www.thezimbabwedaily.com/zimbabwe/33169-school-parents-in-religious-row.html.

http://hubii.com/article/55b9fb8670b966ee030baa95/jehovah-s-witnesses-pupils-school-fight-over-religion.

OrphanCrow

School, parents in religious row

29th ⁄ July ⁄ 2015

http://www.thezimbabwedaily.com/zimbabwe/33169-school-parents-in-religious-row.html

http://hubii.com/article/55b9fb8670b966ee030baa95/jehovah-s-witnesses-pupils-school-fight-over-religion

Fidelis Munyoro Chief Court Reporter—
The Constitutional Court yesterday reserved judgment in the case of four Jehovah’s Witness parents and guardians of pupils attending Anglican-orientated Arundel School who are challenging the school’s requirement of chapel attendance. Four parents — Amos Makani, Mbiri Shiripinda, Plaxedes Chipangura and Daniel Sakupwanya — hold beliefs different to those of other Christian denominations.
They argued that compelling their children to attend chapel services violated their religious beliefs.
The full bench of the constitution led by Chief Justice Godfrey Chidyausiku heard submissions from both parties’ counsel and reserved judgment to a later date.
South African-based Advocate Tererai Mafukidze instructed by Messrs Joshua Shekede and Givemore Madzoka from Wintertons Legal Practitioners argued the matter for the four parents while Adv Adrian de Bourbon represented Arundel and the school head.
Adv Mafukidze argued that it was unconstitutional for the school to discriminate against the four pupils on the grounds of their religious beliefs and this was a violation of the children’s rights. He said it was unlawful for the four pupils to be forced to worship in a chapel full of religious symbols, unlike in the kingdom halls.
“The kingdom halls differ from other religious buildings and chapels in that they do not contain any religious symbols. Arundel chapel has religious symbols strewn all over,” argued Adv Mafukidze.
He submitted that the school authorities were obliged to respect the four’s religion in line with the constitution. The four pupils, he argued, should be excused from attending the chapel meetings.
“When the applicant’s daughters were admitted at the school they were made to sign a standard form,” said Adv Mafukidze.
“They indicated they are members of Jehovah’s Witnesses. Their applications were accepted notwithstanding their membership of the church.”
Adv Mafukidze accused the current school head of changing the previous exemptions granted to those with particular beliefs from attending chapel services on religious grounds.
But Adv de Bourbon urged the court to dismiss constitutional application. The four parents, he argued, waived one of their many religious rights when they allowed their children to be enrolled at the Anglican school. He accused them of fraudulently seeking to change the school’s principles to suit their needs.
Adv de Bourbon said there was no suggestion from the four parents that an attempt was made to persuade their daughters to change their religion or beliefs.

63

Nine Seconds that says it all. Have these elders any shame?

by Wasanelder Once in

what can i add?

this says it all.. elder on stand is mute till prompted.. .

i guess i could encourage you to watch to the end and a guest commentary, lol..

OrphanCrow

Ruby: Os this kind of public hearing even legal in the way it is being conducted?
I'm not on the side of Jehovahs witnesses but I would at least like the hearing to be fair and just.

You bet it is. Have you not bothered to read how and why this was set up? Quit being so self centered to think that the Jehovah's Witnesses are being especially singled out for that so called persecution that they scream about. They are only one of many instuitutions under fire by the Royal Commission.

Educate yourself. The webpage is there with the information as to the "legality" of the Royal Commission and the powers granted it. The Commission has been set up under the order of the Queen of England. They have a well established legal system.

Intellectuals bullies? Lol! Well...if the shoe fits. Tell me why, please, that the experienced, intelligent and rational positioning of legal experts find it so easy to tear apart a bunch of guys who go by "First Century Christian law" instead of the democratic law that recognizes human abuses for what they are.

A fair fight? Not even close. The WTS is getting the shit kicked out of them and it is about time! They are being exposed for the incompetent and arrogant jerks that they are. I am going to cheer for every knock out punch they get. They have been beating up on children and women for far too long now.

Judical hearing? Yeah...how do they like it now??