Quotes from the past ...

by RR 7 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • RR

    In October 11, 1928, Morton Edgar, a prominent Bible Student from Glasgow, most noted for his Great Pyramid books co-authored with his brother John, wote a letter to a "brother". In this letter he gives some insights into the Judge's character, which is of course of no surprise to many. Here my last gift to you on this forum.

    Quotes from the letter:

    I for one entirely repudiate this talk of "God's visible organization on earth" (luring this Gospel Age. It is dangerous talk, and gives rise to all kinds of persecutions and ungodly claims, as anyone who has consecrated reasoning powers can see. We have the whole history of that great "whore," the

    You can locate anything that is visible, especially anything that is visible on earth. But our Lord said that "The Kingdom of God cometh not with outward show: neither shall they say, Lo here! or, Lo there! for. behold, the is in the midst of you." (Diaglott, Luke 17:20, 21). It is an invisible kingdom, and not a visible one. It will be right in the midst of the people, but none will be able to locate it and say: Lo. here it is! right here in the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society, which is God's visible organization on earth! judge 's talk about the "Society" being God's visible organization on earth is totally unscriptural, and this kind of talk deceives none of the Lord's little ones, the little flock to whom it is their Father's good pleasure to give the Kingdom. (Luke 12:32). The word "Organization" is not Scriptural.

    I am not surprised at the attempts that were made to get Brother - to resign from eldership, for this seems to be the practice when anyone disagrees with judge 's teachings, or practices. The London Tabernacle class lost one of their most useful elders recently in this way. This elder had communicated with Judge Rutherford personally on some matter, and judge Rutherford had told him by letter to resign. (this brother told me that the letter he received from Jucfge was so terrible, that he did not feel inclined to show it to others. He did, however. read it out to the class.)

    The brother properly refused to resign. reminding judge that he was elected by the class, and not by him, and that he was answerable to the class only. This (lid not satisfy Judge Rutherford, and when he came over from America (about a year ago now) he set about getting this brother removed from eldership, At the recommendation, and with the agreement, of Brother Hemery this brother had read out all his correspondence with Judge Rutherford, including the last "terrible" letter: and the brethren of the class were not only astonished and grieved, but had re-elected him to eldership and to his place in the executive committee by the greatest number of votes of any.

    Therefore, judge Rutherford on reaching set about to have this brother removed. lie first got Brother Hemery to agree to apologize to the class for having permitted the brother to read out the correspondence. (It appears that, had Brother Hemery taken a stand and refused to obey Judge Rutherford, he would not have continued in the London Bethel much longer. But he agreed to abandon the elder, whom he had always befriended, to his fate, and apologized; and Judge Rutherford clapped him on the back and called him a "manly little brother!'")

    Then, evidently and manifestly by prearrangement, one brothergot up and proposed that the elder be put out of his eldership, and immediately another seconded the motion, and other spoke in favor of the motion. Then on a show of hands the motion was carried through quickly. a hymn of glory to God was sung, and the meeting ended. "Judge Rutherford," said the poor stricken brother, "Will you, as a judge, not permit me, a brother in the Lord, as much liberty to 'state my case" as you would grant to a prisoner at the bar?" "No! You sit down!" And so the brother never got a chance to explain to the class who voted him out at the representations of judge Rutherford.

    After Judge Rutherford had descended from the pulpit (they have a pulpit in the London Tabernacle), and was passing out into the street, a sister, who had been a regular attender of the class for many years, went up to him and said she would like to ask some questions. When this was granted, she asked him: "Some of the things you said about this brother, I know are not correct. Who told you about them?" "What do you know about it?" he replied. "Some of the brethren who were present at the meetings where this matter was discussed wrote to me about it, and that is why I know." "But, brother, I also was at these meetings, and took notes, and I know that some of the things you charge against this brother are not true." "You're a liar!" and the "friend of the people" passed on in his way out. lie had accomplished his purpose of drumming the brother out of his eldership, and that was all he cared for. And our Lord said: "The merciful shall obtain mercy" (Matt. 5:7). James said: "For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath chewed no mercy" (Jas. 2:13).

    At the Albert Hall meeting in May. 1926. Judge Rutherford shocked the public, no less than the brethren, by roaring out from the platform: "Shut up!" - A little woman in the audience had raised her voice in protest at something he had said, and this is how Judge Rutherford answered her. He then roared out still louder, if anything: "Put that woman out!" and as she was being conducted out of the hall he continue(]: "It cost you nothing to come in, and it will cost you nothing to go out!" He also made a number of derogatory remarks about women in general. To us the whole outburst from the platform seemed so needless and overbearing: and we could not help contrasting the scene with the gentle, patient waywith which Brother Russell dealt with his numerous interrupters. Whether it was as owing to this incident, or because Judge Rutherford took the opportunity to run down while in this great hall, or, possibly, because of both these things, he was at all events refused the use of this hall next time he came over. (Albert Ball is the largest in , and is the representative hall of the nation, being used for all the most important meetings. Brother Russell had the use of it a number of times.)

    For there is no doubt whatever that the "Society" claims for itself much power over the spirit-begotten children of God. The comment that you quote from the 1928 "Year Book," under the heading of 23rd May, undoubtedly implies that, apart from the "Society" there can be no acceptable worship or service to our heavenly Father. The comment says: "As surely as God made the place or center of worship, just so surely now he has made his visible organization on earth the place where he accepts the praise and service of his people. His anointed (spirit-begotten) ones associate themselves together in what we call the Society, to do the work of Jehovah as he has commanded. ..."

    If this is literally true, then our heavenly Father will not accept our worship and service unless we will agree that the "Society" is the sole channel of approach to Him. The "commands of our heavenly Father can come to Ills children only through the "Society," God's "visible organization on earth." In other words, none of the Lord's children could hope to gain salvation except through the "Society." Indeed. God could not "beget" I His children except through the "Society." And we are not answerable to our heavenly Father for lie will not recognize us except through the "Society." We, the spirit-begotten children of God. are answerable to the "Society," and to it alone; and the "Society" assumes to itself the power to bless or curse us as it sees good-to commend us if we are in "harmony with its teachings," no matter how nonsensical these "teachings" may sometimes be (and often are!) - or to "excommunicate" us if it deems us "not in harmony with the teachings."

  • Leolaia

    That was a nice little gem. I enjoy reading things from the "Dark Ages" of the Society, which are generally really hard to find (and the Society is loathe to make them public). What is your source for the letter?

    I wish you were not leaving us, but do take care of yourself.

  • ozziepost
    I wish you were not leaving us, but do take care of yourself.

    I second that.

  • BeelzeDub

    I for one, have always enjoyed reading your posts of insight into WT history. Even though I don't come here as often as I did in the past, there are a few posters I always try to read, RR is one of those posters.

    It is really a shame that a few newbies on this forum, can't respect diversity within the XJW community, but instead feel the need to dog with name calling and racial slurs toward a long time poster like RR for his personal convictions. This goes on while mods are more concerned about **** out 'hole' from asshole, so as not to offend someone. Sad really!

    Yes, there are many posters here on this forum, however quantity does not equal quality. Like the Watchtower Society, this forum continues to loose many of the best and brightest long term posters who like RR contributed some real meat to this forum over a 4 year period.

    I now have one less reason to come visit here. You are a good man RR, may god bless you and yours, you will be missed.


  • shotgun


    I took RR to mean he is taking a hiatus from the forum, I don't want to see him leave and sent him a pm to that effect. I think a hiatus when your ticked off is better than getting involved in a full blown donnybrook, so good on him.

    I would have to say though that he gives out just as many rebukes as he receives, and it maybe impossible to discuss C.T Russell and his beliefs with RR because just like faithful WT believers he takes offense easily to ones who poke holes in his beliefs.

    The other option would be for others not to poke holes in his beliefs but simply let threads on the truthful teachings of CTR and the fullfillment of numerous bible prophecies in the First Six Studies of the Scriptures alone. In that case only RR would post on them because no one other than a bible student is going to proclaim that Jesus returned invisibly in 1874 and appointed CTR as the FDS to provide meat in due season and so on.

    RR has done excellent research on the WT and it's early years and his posts on such are greatly appreciated.

    Maybe a few remarks were said by some which were not called for, when that happens the response given to these remarks often determines what direction the discussion will take.


  • Farkel

    Best of luck to you in life, RR. I've always enjoyed your comments and side with those who are sad you are leaving.


  • VM44


    Glad you posted the excerpts from the letter. It does indeed give insight as to how "humble" Rutherford really was.

    I am sorry that you are leaving. Hope it will be temporary. Always liked reading your posts.


  • VM44
    the whole outburst from the platform seemed so needless and overbearing

    That is a good word to describe Rutherford.

    Rutherford was a loud, overbearing, pompous OAF!


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