Witnesses having children

by JH 8 Replies latest jw friends

  • JH
    JH

    I remember when I started mingling with the JW's in the mid 80's, they said that it was too late in this system to have children. The great tribulation just around the corner made it a bad idea to have children, they said.

    Today with just about "Zero increase" having children is a way of ensuring future witnesses. I didn't set foot in a KH in 2 years, but if I remember well, the only new faces I saw were children that became adults.

    I wonder if they still discourage witnesses from having children...or do they see it as something good now, since not many are joining?

  • TD
    TD

    Good point JH. You would think they would realize this out of sheer pragmatism alone

    But from what I've seen, the Witnesses don't exploit even the potential they have. Their retention rate must be dismal, as it appears to me that easily 8 out of 10 children eventually leave the faith. I think the realization that child-bearing is one of the best sources of new converts will probably go hand in hand with the realization that what the church currently does for its children is completely inadequate.

    Of course suddenly "discovering" what the Mormons and Catholics have known all along would be a bitter pill to swallow for such a haughty, prideful leadership.

  • somebodylovesme
    somebodylovesme

    Don't know what the official word is, but the three young newlywed JW couples I know all plan on having children in the next couple years.

    SLM

  • stillajwexelder
    stillajwexelder

    In 1988 worldwide at the District Convention, there was a talk entitled "Responsible Child Rearing in the Time of the End" -- basically actively discouraging witnesses having children -- then about 1993/1994 the growth was starting to slow --then came the Generation farce -- and more dropped away -- and all of a sudden in dawned on The Governing Potty in Brooklyn -- hey , actually most of our growth comes from witness children getting baptized -- and although there was no official policy change as far as I am aware, there seemed to be a spurt of babies in the congregation -- hell I even had another child myself . (well my wife did - I had the enjoyable part - you know the sperm donation bit) . Now I might be imagining this -- but as far as I know there is no official policy on babies -- but if you can put them off and regular pioneer that is always good for ass licking points with the hierarchy. But if you have a baby it is uisually a cause for rejoicing in the congregation -- you will not get looked down upon.

  • JT
    JT

    In 1988 worldwide at the District Convention, there was a talk entitled "Responsible Child Rearing in the Time of the End"

    O yes how I recall that talk-- that was the year I got married- ---

    here is a repost where I discussed this issue at length in terms of what ?MOLDED? the thinking of my wife and I about having kids, over the years growing up as a JW kid, young adult and adult

    I turn 41 in just 7 more days- you got to love it

    Repost OF

    WHY LADY C AND JT HAVE NO KIDS-- WT STYLE

    As well as COMMENTS TO MY THREAD ARE HERE

    http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/59618/1.ashx

    *** g74 11/8 ***9 Is This the Time to Have Children?There has always been a positive attitude about childbearing. Families with many children have been praised and honored. On the other hand,?a couple without children has been considered unfortunate. Barrenness has even been regarded as a reproach to a woman.

    This attitude is changing, however. Many informed couples nowadays hesitate when it comes to childbearing, asking themselves: Is this really a time to have children?

    *** g74 11/8 10 Is This the Time to Have Children? ***Ominous Predictions

    Further reinforcing the decision of some couples are ominous predictions for the immediate future.

    *** g74 11/8 11 Is This the Time to Have Children? ***Significantly, in the first century Jesus Christ himself gave an ominous forecast regarding a calamity coming upon Judea.

    It was in 66 C.E. that the armies of Roman general Cestius Gallus encamped around Jerusalem, but then withdrew, apparently without any reason for doing so. This provided believers in Jesus? prediction opportunity to flee. Those who did so were wise, for shortly afterward the Roman armies returned and the destruction upon those who remained was terrible beyond description.

    The circumstance that Jesus foretold proved true: ?Woe to the pregnant women and the ones suckling a baby in those days! For there will be great necessity upon the land.? (Luke 21:23) One can be sure that flight was more difficult for delaying parents with small children. If you had been living prior to that destruction and knew of its nearness, would you have considered that a time to be having children inside the province of Judea?

    Today there is a great crowd of people who are confident that a destruction of even greater magnitude is now imminent. The evidence is that Jesus? prophecy will shortly have a major fulfillment, upon this entire system of things. This has been a major factor in influencing many couples to decide not to have children at this time. They have chosen to remain childless so that they would be less encumbered to carry out the instructions of Jesus Christ to preach the good news of God?s kingdom earth wide before the end of this system comes.?Matt. 24:14.

    My mother was carrying my baby brother Steve when this article came out- she was asked by one sister: "How will you run when the tribulation starts"

    My mother used to cry and pray that my brother would be born before the end came-

    This type of information was played up by CO, DO and Bethel speakers and tons of local elders- this type of material was used to fire up the troops and even down till today

    Many couples still refrain from having kids since the end is so near-

    My wife and I are a 40yr old black couple with no kids and Why- well THE END IS SO CLOSE

    IT becomes very clear when one understands the influence that the wt has on it's members to understand how they indoctrinate it's members

    Notice the title of the Article itself (Is This the Time to Have Children?)

    LIKE SO many articles that the wt writes they ask leading questions then they provide what is considered Proof to lead one to the conclusion that they want you to come to without even having to tell you.

    Now did they say not to have children NOPE, but what did they do- they set up the circumstances to lead one to the conclusion that having children now while not wrong--- is not wise or the "Mature" Christian couple would consider that they can use the time better doing what SELLING WATCHTOWER'S BOOKS

    THE sad part is when one looks at the year that this article was written it is almost a joke in and of itself

    This is why groups like jw are often referred to as Doomsday groups

    I mean notice this powerful quote from this article:

    Today there is a great crowd of people who are confident that a destruction of even greater magnitude is now imminent. The evidence is that Jesus? prophecy will shortly have a major fulfillment, upon this entire system of things. This has been a major factor in influencing many couples to decide not to have children at this time. They have chosen to remain childless so that they would be less encumbered

    Now let's break this down-:: Why are these people confident that a destruction is NOW IMMINENT? What does imminent mean? In the minds of the avg person would they consider------ "Imminent"-------- to mean--- 6months,maybe a year or would they be thinking 25 or more years?

    Notice this quote:

    . The evidence is that Jesus? prophecy will shortly have a major fulfillment

    Who has determined what constitutes "Evidence" THE LAPD Crime LAB?

    AND what does Shortly mean? So that a couple need not consider having kids?

    3months 9 months a year or would the avg person consider the word "Shortly" to mean 25 yrs?

    Next quote:

    "This has been a major factor in influencing many couples to decide not to have children"

    what is the "THIS" that has cause not a few but "MANY COUPLES" from having kids.

    Did this "THIS" prove true so that the folks who didn't have kids were correct or did it prove to be no more than AN OPINION NOT BASED ON THE BIBLE AT ALL?

    MANY jw who come here and folks like "OLD HIPPIE" clearly fail to see how this type of information- claiming it's authority directly from god through his mouth PC has influenced so many millions of JW in the type of decisions that they have made in their life

    This is why the wt is so dangerous-- they provide so much info in talks and publications that shape and mold folks thinking , value system and outlook on life such as college, kids, jobs, retirement, etc. and why

    Cause jw are to view this as FOOD FROM GOD- NOT OPINIONS FROM THE BOYS IN WRITING

    If the wt did bible commentary on issues they would be fine-- since it would be understood that the "Following is the opinion of the WT Editorial Staff"

    But they don't THEY STATE MATTERS ON issues and say THIS IS NEW LIGHT FROM JAH HIMSELF- then in 5 years we all have seen how God got the light wrong

    The wt paper trail is their worst enemy for it clearly shows to any real researcher that their claim to being "Spirit Directed" is wrong

    Yes WT will be around for years to come since they do sell hope and they promise every new member a "Breach Front Timeshare PC of Property"

    Problem is the same of course it's always for WEEK 53

    James

  • Odrade
    Odrade

    yeah, family member told me last night that she "wasted" nine years pioneering, and they put off having kids all that time because they thought Armaggedon was right around the corner. She has two lovely children now, but I know she took a LOT of flack for getting pregnant in the time of the end.

    I've also mentioned before (I think in your thread JT) how my mom always says "Oh, no!" when she hears of any young JW couple getting preggo or having kids. Even if they want the kid... pretty sick. She's thrilled that I don't have any. Even more so now that she believes I'm going to get smooshed like a bug at Armaggedon. bleh.

    Odrade

  • little witch
    little witch

    I wonder if in 50 years Jehovah witness furniture will be showcased in antique stores? Tee Hee Hee

    (reference to the Shakers)

  • neverin
    neverin

    The dates given for the guidance make sense to me now. My JW (now Elder) brother got married in 1985 and he and his wife were determined NEVER to have children in this system of things. Amazingly in 1993 my Sister in Law became pregnant (planned) and they had a son the day after I had my eldest daughter. However they have only had the one child and he is indoctrinated to beleive that the end is nigh - he asked me in August 2002 if I thougth it would happen by 'the end of the year?' poop lamb he hasn't grasped the fact that hid Dad,Grandad & Uncle have been waiting for 30+ years for this imminent event - will he be preaching it to his kids?

    BTW the only time I have been really hurt by this stupid belief is when I had my eldest daughter christened in a C of E church and my Dad told me I had signed her death warrant - my reply was that if there was anything after death at least I would be going to the same place as my baby, but guess what? We're still here along with my 2nd daughter and wonderful husband.

  • dothemath
    dothemath

    I think this issue has turned around 180 degrees from years ago. Some have already mentioned references to past statements about "responsible childbearing".......etc. In the past it was pretty much discouraged. But the last summer's district convention had a part which was quite different.

    Children are now considered a "blessing" again. What a difference from other conventions.........I recall an interview with a pioneer couple (early 1980's).........they "vowed to never have children, and never to own a house" right from the platform. (I recall the CO saying..."that's great"......most of the audience applauded....)

    There've been numerous occasions when parents were made to feel quite uncomfortable when an over-zealous brother had a part regarding this subject over the years..........what has resulted is that the most spiritually-minded ones decided against a family.........ones not so inclined to go by "the letter of the law" did have families.

    I wonder if that pioneer couple have lived up to their vow yet today?

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