Jesus beside "the Only God"

by grzesiek32 6 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • grzesiek32
    grzesiek32

    There are some verses that non-trinitarians like most, because those verses say about both Jesus and "The only God". Have a look at them:

    Jn 17:3
    Now this is eternal life: that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.
    (NIV)

    Kor 8:6
    yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live.
    (NIV)

    Tyt 2:5
    For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
    (NIV)

    But they haven't noticed, that one of them is against their interpretation. It is that:

    Kor 8:6
    yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live.
    (NIV)

    If they claim, that The Father is the only God and in this way Jesus isn't God, let them be consistent!!! If Jesus cannot be God then Father cannot be Lord, because Lord is only one, and Jesus is this Lord! Let's look at similar verses:

    Jude 1:4
    For certain men whose condemnation was written about long ago have secretly slipped in among you. They are godless men, who change the grace of our God into a license for immorality and deny Jesus Christ our only Sovereign (gr. 'despotEs') and Lord (gr. 'Lord').
    (NIV)

    In this verse Jesus is called only Sovereign and Lord although the Father is called both Sovereign and Lord as well:

    Act 4:24-27
    24. When they heard this, they raised their voices together in prayer to God. "Sovereign Lord," (gr. despotEs) they said, "you made the heaven and the earth and the sea, and everything in them.
    25. You spoke by the Holy Spirit through the mouth of your servant, our father David: "'Why do the nations rage and the peoples plot in vain?
    26. The kings of the earth take their stand and the rulers gather together against the Lord (gr. kurios) and against his Anointed One.'
    27. Indeed Herod and Pontius Pilate met together with the Gentiles and the people of Israel in this city to conspire against your holy servant Jesus, whom you anointed.
    (NIV)

    Non-trinitarians seeing those verses:

    Rev 19:13-16
    13. He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and his name is the Word of God.
    14. The armies of heaven were following him, riding on white horses and dressed in fine linen, white and clean.
    15. Out of his mouth comes a sharp sword with which to strike down the nations. "He will rule them with an iron scepter." He treads the winepress of the fury of the wrath of God Almighty.
    16. On his robe and on his thigh he has this name written: KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS.
    (NIV)

    have to say that Jesus is the Lord of His Father, because He is a greater Lord than His Father!

    If Jehovah's Witnesses insist that in verse Act 4:26 should be JHVH, let's show them that verse:

    Ps 8:1
    1. O Jehovah our Lord, how majestic your name is in all the earth, You whose dignity is recounted above the heavens!
    (NWT)

    What is more, seeing this verse:

    Mr 12:29
    29. "The most important one," answered Jesus, "is this: 'Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one.
    (NIV)

    non-trinitarians have to say, that the Bible contradicts itself!

    Grzegorz Zebrowski (Greg from Poland)

    This article is also here : http://www.trinitarians.republika.pl

  • Narkissos
    Narkissos

    Welcome Greg,

    IMO the Bible does contradict itself. A lot. Probably a reason why I still like it.

  • Leolaia
    Leolaia
    If they claim, that The Father is the only God and in this way Jesus isn't God, let them be consistent!!! If Jesus cannot be God then Father cannot be Lord, because Lord is only one, and Jesus is this Lord!

    That is a great point!!! And indeed Jude 4 calls Jesus Christ "our only Master and Lord," applying both despotes and kurios to Jesus. This might be an allusion to Jeremiah 3:14 which says: "It is Yahweh who speaks for I alone am your Master." Kurios is the word that takes the place of YHWH in the Septuagint (cf. Romans 10:13, applied to Jesus, quoting Joel 2:32, referring to YHWH). Despotes, which in the Septuagint also refers to YHWH (cf. Jeremiah 4:10; 15:11) is used in Luke 2:29, Acts 4:24 to refer to "God" and 2 Peter 2:1, Revelation 6:10 to refer to Jesus (in addition to Jude 4).

    Leolaia

  • LittleToe
    LittleToe

    Thomas's words at John 20:28 ("My Lord and my God"), are pretty awkward for them to answer, too.

  • AGuest
    AGuest

    dear ones... and may you have peace.

    Until the point when "all authority" was given my Lord by my Father... which occurred after his death and resurrection... the Father WAS "the only true God." But when He conferred such authority on my Lord, he, my Lord, the Son... BECAME... our "God"... by means of having ALL things given him by the Father. For ALL things were subjected to him... INCLUDING US... with the exception of JAH, the One who subjected all things TO the Son.

    John 17:2; 1 Corinthians 15:27

    And yet, although he had such position, my Lord humbled himself... and STILL humbles himself... before the Father... and glorified Him... and STILL glorifies Him... and instructs us to do so as well. The Son, although worthy of our worship... COMMANS us... to worship God.

    Mark 10:18; Luke 4:7, 8; John 14:28; John 17:1-26; Revelation 22:9

    Unlike our Adversary, who, rather than appreciating the position given him and standing firm and not trying to usurp a higher position, tried to garner the worship that belongs to God alone... for himself.

    Ezekiel 28:17; Luke 4:7

    I exhort you, those of you who thirst for truth, who truly wish to know the TRUTH... receive such truth FROM the Truth (John 14:6), the One who TELLS us that there is no one higher for us than the Son, except the One whom the Son told us to glorify, the Father.

    We, puny humans that we are... CANNOT get to, come to, see, hear or approach the Father... UNLESS we enter, go, hear and speak... through the Son. The Son... has been exalted so that he has the highest "seat" in the universe, save only that of the Father. So that just as Joseph became "god" to those seeking grain during the famine of that time, the Son is "God" to us. However, at that time there was still one higher than Joseph, the one whose grain the people sought so as to eat and live... but had to get... from Joseph... and that was Pharaoh. Pharaoh conferred ALL that he possessed upon Joseph so that by JOSEPH's authority... as evidenced by a signet ring bearing Pharaoh's inscription... the people were able to procure what was Pharaoh's for themselves... but did so through Joseph. And thus, Joseph was "lord" over the land... as was Pharaoh. And yet, Joseph... was not Pharaoh.

    So, too, there is still One higher than the Son, the one whose SPIRIT we are to seek... so as to drink... and live. My Father, the Most Holy One of Israel, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob (Israel), whose name is JAH... of Armies... conferred ALL that HE possesses upon His Son and Christ, JAHESHUA, so that by JAHESHUA's authority... as evidenced by His SPIRIT being upon that One... ALL of earthling man... who so wish it... are able to procure what is GOD's... for themselves... but must do so through JAHESHUA.

    Matthew 3:16, 17; 17:5

    And thus, my Lord, JAHESHUA MISCHAJAH, the HOLY One of Israel, who is the Son and Christ of JAH, the MOST Holy One of Israel... IS Lord... over ALL the land... and IS God... just as my Father, JAH, is Lord and God.

    And yet, my Lord, JAHESHUA... is not my Father, JAH... no more than Joseph was Pharaoh. Rather... he is the One who CAME... and will yet come again... in the NAME... of JAH.

    Joseph = The Son/Christ

    Pharaoh = The Father/JAH

    Grain = The means by which we live, manna... "the bread from heaven"... manifested in the flesh and blood of Christ... which, by means of the SPIRIT in such flesh and blood... the spirit of God which spirit does NOT die... HOLY SPIRIT... we... shall live!

    May those with ears to hear... hear... and get the sense of this truth... and why it was that the story of Joseph had to occur and be told in the first place: to help all those wishing... to "see"... the truth of this matter. And if you have not ears... may you ask... and receive them.

    But know this, that it is not by "searching the scriptures" that you will come to know the truth, for the truth can only be known by means OF the Truth (John 14:6), the Son of God. If you know him, the Truth... HE will set you free: free from confusion of what is true and what is not, as well as free from the boundaries that are set by our flesh so as not be to able to know what is true, for it is our flesh that enslaves us and restricts us from seeing what is unseen... and hearing what cannot be heard with the flesh. You will know the Truth, and the Truth will set you FREE. And if the Son sets you free... you will truly BE free!

    Thus, I exhort you, too, to "hear" his words of caution against "searching the scriptures"... versus going directly to him:

    "You are searching the scriptures... because you THINK... that by means of THEM... you will have everlasting life. And these are the very ones... that bear witness... about ME... and yet... you do not want to come... to ME... that you may have life."

    John 5:39, 40

    The Bible... is NOT the Word of God; the SON is the Word of God... and it is to HIM that you are to listen. HE is the Word... the TRUTH... by which we are sanctified. There is nothing... and noone... else.

    John 17:17; Revelation 19:13; John 14:6; Hebrews 13:12; Matthew 17:5; John 10:3, 27

    Pay attention, therefore, with your HEARTS... and incline your HEARTS... to the Truth... the Truth that is my Lord, the Son of God... so as to hear him! Do as he directed and HUMBLE yourselves before the Most Holy One of Israel... and do NOT continue in your contending with the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob... and HE Himself will come and make His abode with you... dwell IN you... the Father AND the Son... so that the Son can grant you his spirit, the spirit given him by my Father, HOLY SPIRIT... EYESALVE... so that you may see all that is and was... and will be.

    John 14:23; Romans 8:9, 10; Revelation 3:17, 18

    So do not continue in your "contests" against the Holy Spirit... inquiring as to what is true or not true by means of the things contained in the Bible. Leave off your contention... all you who are Israel... and KISS THE SON!

    May the undeserved kindness and mercy of my God and Father, the MOST Holy One of Israel, whose name is JAH... of Armies... and the peace of His Son and Christ, my Lord, the Holy One of Israel, whose name is JAHESHUA MISCHAJAH... be upon you... you and your entire household... if you so wish it...

    Your servant and a slave of Christ,

    SJ

  • U.2.K. Tha Greate$t
    U.2.K. Tha Greate$t

    If the messiah never came out and said he was god, then he aint god. He always said he was the son of god and god was always with him and he was sent from god and he also prayed to god. people is just confused.

  • AGuest
    AGuest

    although he never called himself such, it was prophesied that he would be called such... or "divine one", which means pretty much the same thing... as would those who belong to him... yes?

    Isaiah 9:6; Psalm 82:6

    There is no error in calling my Lord "God" or "god"... or calling even the chosen ones such... for they are "holy". Even Satan is a "god"... albeit of this realm. The ERROR... is with regard to whom you WORSHIP... for it is written that it is JAH that you must worship and to Him alone you must render sacred service.

    My Lord, the SON of God... although a god as well... did not ask us to worship himself... nor require it. Like the angel of the ark, Michael, the SON... has directed us to worship the Father.

    But... the Father HAS directed us to KISS the Son... and LISTEN to him... for by means of doing so... you will be listening... to God. For he... and only he... is God's Word. You cannot see, hear... or come to the Father... unless you go THROUGH... the Son.

    Revelation 19:13; John 1:14; Matthew 17:5; John 14:6

    Peace to you!

    A slave of Christ,

    SJ

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