War question

by tmkm130 7 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • tmkm130

    Hi, my father is a Jehovah's witness. My sister wanted to do something nice for him and decided to have a shirt made with the ship he was on when he was in the navy many years ago. He was not in the war, but he said that he can't wear it because Jehovah's witnesses don't believe in war. I don't think he understands the Jehovah's witness beliefs. If it is true, I understand and would like to know what scripture backs it up. If it's not, then I'd like to politely educate him. Please let me know. Thank you.

  • Tameria2001

    This might get you started on why he said that. https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1102002078

    The Watchtower tells their members that they are no part of the world, meaning they don't get involved in quite a bit of things, the military is one of those things. I remember when I was a JW one of the things I was told that if a person became a JW, and they had anything such as a cross that was a family heirloom, they would have to destroy or throw away that item.

  • days of future passed
    days of future passed

    Yes as Jehovah's witnesses they wouldn't want to have emblems or beliefs that don't go along with their religion.

    In the past, they actually did go to "war" and in the bible, there is nothing that specifically prohibits it. I'll just paste part of an article that I got at https://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/war.php - this is just so you know. Most JW's will not care if older articles contradict what is being taught now. They also wouldn't want any emblems of their countries flags since it would represent them worshiping a man made government instead of God's kingdom.

    Watchtower justifies Old Testament Jewish war as necessary to cleanse the promised land of infidels. In the same manner, Christian Churches express their engagement in warfare as a role ordained by God. The very existence of Jehovah's Witnesses is a result of the global expansion of Christianity at the end of the sword.

    The Bible never specifically forbids Christian engagement in warfare, and since this was such a significant aspect to Bible history, if continued engagement in war had become an unacceptable practice to the writers of the Christian Scriptures they would have stated so. In fact, several New Testament passages indicate acceptance of war.

    When military officers came to John for baptism, John did not direct them to leave the service.

    Luke 3:14 "Also, those in military service would ask him: "What shall we also do?" And he said to them: "Do not harass anybody or accuse anybody falsely, but be satisfied with YOUR provisions."

    At Matthew 8:5-13 Jesus did not turn the soldier away when asking to heal his manservant, rather commending him saying "I have not found anyone In Israel with such great faith" In the account at Acts 10 Cornelius was not required to step down as commander of Roman soldiers before being baptised.

    Paul shows that governments have a right to use the sword to prevent bad, and that we should be in subjection to what they demand of us. This would include going to war when called for.

    Romans 13:1-4 "Let every soul be in subjection to the superior authorities, for there is no authority except by God; the existing authorities stand placed in their relative positions by God. Therefore he who opposes the authority has taken a stand against the arrangement of God; those who have taken a stand against it will receive judgment to themselves. For those ruling are an object of fear, not to the good deed, but to the bad. Do you, then, want to have no fear of the authority? Keep doing good, and you will have praise from it; for it is God's minister to you for your good. But if you are doing what is bad, be in fear: for it is not without purpose that it bears the sword; for it is God's minister, an avenger to express wrath upon the one practicing what is bad."

    Russell recognised this scripture required early Witnesses to engage in civilian service and even attend the front line.

    "The early Bible Students took this scripture to mean that if a Christian was drafted in wartime, he would be obligated to put on a uniform, shoulder a gun, and go to the front, to the trenches. It was felt that since a Christian could not kill a fellow human, he would be compelled to fire his gun into the air if worst came to worst." Watchtower 1995 May 15 pp.21-22
  • Black Sheep
    Black Sheep

    Educating someone who doesn't want to be educated is a thankless task.

    I would suggest that you don't damage your relationship with him over it. Ask him if he knows anyone who might appreciate it, then give it to them

  • smiddy3

    Jehovah`s Witnesses like to pick and choose what scripture they will obey and those they don`t like or contradicts their beliefs. So you will have an uphill battle with this question.

    First off J.W`s do believe in war ,they believe in the" War of the Great day of God Almighty at Armageddon" by Christ Jesus/Jehovah God.

    That will kill billions of people man woman and child simply because they are not Jehovah`s witnesses anytime soon.

    Jehovah God is well known as being a war God in the Old Testament. He sanctioned many wars including genocide of many peoples and Nations.

    In the New Testament Cornelius an army officer of the italian band was favoured by Jehovah God and accepted while he was in the army and there is no indication he ever left or was required to do so.

    I wish you well in talking to your father ,but i`m afraid it will fall on deaf ears .

    There is a scripture in the Bible that is applied to false gods & Idols ,however I find it aptly applies to Jehovah`s Witnesses.

    Psalm 115: 5-8

    "Eyes they have but they cannot see,

    Ears they have but they cannot hear,

    and a mouth they have but they cannot speak."

    that is The Truth About The Truth , ( TTATT) but that`s just the way I see things.

    And please let us know how you get on.

  • waton

    t130: Many people are too dignified to become walking billboards for any cause, and your father may be one of them. but

    let us assume he served in the merchant marine convoys that supplied the war effort against the axis power, which the watchtower writers , in Reve. 12:16, equate with the instruments of the dragon that persecuted the jw religion during WW2. so your father , in that angle of his belief, was part of "the Earth" that swallowed up that torrent of persecution.

    Your father might , deep down, actually be proud of that role he played in his life, and of you recognizing it.

  • BluesBrother

    Hello tmkm30,

    Your father is not wrong about the J W beliefs... Serving in the military is definitely not allowed , they would be conscientious objectors if necessary.

    However, this was a loving gift ,specially nade, from a loved one. If this had happened to me when I served as a JW, I am sure I would have accepted the gift in the spirit of love.

    Mind you, I could never wear it in the company of other Witnesses. .....

    Sadly though, many Witnesses are not so reasonable and see only the "rules"

  • Giordano

    It's all made up in the JW world. Your father is simply saying what the WT has promoted.

    Have your sister or you donate the shirt where veterans gather....maybe it could be auctioned off....maybe a veteran can identify with the shirt and wear it with pride.

    Apparently you and your sister haven't looked into the destructive nature of being a JW.

    Google Rutherford's (The 2nd Watchtower President) letter to Hitler when he wanted to get the JW printing presses released. His stupidity caused at least 500 JW's to die. But hey no real loss cause there will be a resurrection for loyal JW's.

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