Babylon The Great and JWs

by Ireneus 7 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • Ireneus

    JWs teach Babylon the Great is the whole empire of false religion. Interestingly, Bible’s definition of it would include JWs also because it is the entity “that rules over the kings of the earth.” (Rev 17:18) Since Revelation is given in symbols (Rev 1:1) “kings” cannot be literal, but can mean minds of people because mind acts like king over everyone’s bodily kingdom.

    No one exerts power over the minds of JWs like their GB does. Just like members of other religions blindly follow what their leaders teach, JWs too do—even when changes that are introduced under the guise of “new light” are virtually numerous. ( No one thinks ‘If God does not change’ (Malachi 3:6) how can He go on changing His teachings with no end? Numerous changes also highlight the degree of confusion it has got (just like the very name ‘babel’ which means confusion (Gen. 11:4–9)

  • Crazyguy

    God doesn’t change I’m mean theres a scripture in Jeremiah where it says god never even thought of the idea of a human or animal sacrifice. It’s wasnt he who sent his only begotten son to be sacrificed right?

  • venus


    The scripture you have in mind is Jeremiah 7:31 where God reveals His position with regard to human sacrifices--"something I did not command, nor did it enter my mind."

  • The Fall Guy
    The Fall Guy

    Grammatically & logically, since Babylon the Great is defined as "the mother of the harlots," (plural) then clearly "she" cannot be a single worldwide conglomerate of religions, but rather the single greatest "harlot" which engendered all the rest.

  • venus

    A harlot sells her own flesh in exchange for something else. Religions sells their very essence, the very meaning of the word ‘religion’ (from re-ligare,” Latin, to “re-connect”) by poorly depicting God which repels rather than attract the logical minds. For example, religions teach that God gives eternal pleasure in heaven or eternal suffering in hell on the basis of a short life lived on earth, or permits souls to merge with Him which means extinction.

  • MrRoboto

    Then there's another interpretation of "earth" which would be something more like the Jewish system at the time. Some preterists ascribe to this idea as it seems to make more sense given the rest of revelation.

    by committing spiritual adultery, as she often did, Israel became a harlot, this is confirmed by the bible. There's a lot more in revelation that points to Israel/Jerusalem being Babylon the great, mother of the prostitutes.

    Anyone remember what her fate was supposed to be? And the "this generation" that Jesus was speaking to would have witnessed it all.

    I'd be a preterist for sure if I still believed in the infallibility of the bible.

    (preterists believe some or all of the end time prophecies were fulfilled in the 1st century, centering on the destruction of Jerusalem)

  • venus

    MrRoboto, that's interesting.

    People who claimed as God’s own, when they turned unfaithful, were described as “harlot” by prophet Isaiah. (Isaiah 1:21) Interestingly, Jesus makes no mention of God’s own people existing as organized ones till the end of the world. (Mathew 25:31-46)

  • myelaine

    Mr. Roboto...
    You said, "by committing spiritual adultery, as she often did, Israel became a harlot, this is confirmed by the bible. There's a lot more in revelation that points to Israel/Jerusalem being Babylon the great, mother of the prostitutes."

    The torah prescribes a sacrifice for the sin of adultry. (Lev. 19:20-22) if the woman is not freed. (God asked israel, "where is the certificate of your divorce?")
    Though the prophets often called israel back to God, the priests didn't make a sacrifice for the sin of israel's adultry. The scriptures declared that God looked around and any one indivdual who practiced the truth became prey to those who practiced unrighteousness.
    God asks, "am I not righteous to save?" And "my own right arm will sustain Me" Scripture says that God's Servant is the right arm of God...that the Servant receives His righteousness from God. Scripture goes on to say that this Servant's soul is made an atonement for sin/transgression. This Servant is God's own right arm that sustains His own righteousness to save BECAUSE israel doesn't recognise their sinful state. So, while it is absolutely true that God didn't COMMAND a man to be sacrificed for sin in the torah or anywhere else in scripture, the scriptures themselves declare that it pleased God to see His Servant willingly "see his soul travail on behalf of many" (in order to be delivered up as the sacrifice for the atonement of THEIR (israel's) sin.) The penalty for adultry without delivering the required sacrifice is death.

    God saved many from the penalty of death by the sacrifice of His willing Servant whom He calls His own right arm. God is righteous to save even when man is blind to his need for salvation.

    Israel didn't recognize Jesus from the OT scriptures for a few reasons. He was hidden from them as an arrow in a quiver, He was under the cover of God's hand and they hid their face from Him (didn't recognize or acknowledge
    their own sin)...the NT says though He was sinless [like an arrow hitting the mark perfectly] He became sin.

    The mother of all harlots would recognize and acknowledge that sacrifice has been made for sin (Jesus) betroth herself (bride) but she would continue in her sin.

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