I have been reading a lot of the comments on the new childrens book released at the convention. I must say this book turns my stomach. You know, for years the WTS has demanded thier religious freedom in the courts and won many decisions based on thier First Amendment right to worship as they choose. They do this deceptively, by presenting themselves as a spiritually healthy religion. However, since 911, this country has focused on terrorism and its fearful threats against our society. We have become more aware of the impact of psycholigical threats of acts of violence against our cities, our people and our governmental, and historical institutions, our communities, our very families. I have heard on news reports that it is unlawful for the "burning" of a cross by those who believe that others are inferior to them, and anyone doing such an act is considered to be doing an act of terrorism by causing fear, and threat of death. So then, what about the religious freedom of those who would publish these acts of violence in pictures to the families, and children within thier religious community, in a psychlogically threatening way as to give the message that if you don't go along with our beliefs, you will be violently murdered, along with your government, your schools, your classmates, your non believing family members, your community. If you don't believe the doctrines of our religion you deserve to be dead, and you will be dead. I do not think the Supreme Court would agree with the pictures in the publications of Watchtower which it feeds to families within, while misrepresenting themselves in their communities. These death threatening violent pictures which the children grow up seeing and hearing is causing very harmful consequences on them and their parents who also live thier lives in fear of virtually everything. This is not religious freedom but religious terrorism and spiritual abuse. I wish more of this would come to the attention of the press, and the courts, because these things are being done under the guise of religious freedom. Does anyone here feel this way?
WT & Religous Freedom vs Religous Terrorism/ Opinions?
by ARoarer 7 Replies latest jw friends
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alamb
I agree fully. But the dilemna that must be worked through is the violation of civil rights vs. first amendment rights. Until a judge goes there, the basis is thin. We can look at the KKK and see their freedom of belief is hampered by their inability to act against blacks per se. Some court decisions in the US have come close to restricting first amendment rights to protect the civil rights of a person. Vicky Boer's decision in Canada addressed this issue and went further into these uncharted waters. Let's hope this is the beginning.
Another question: Death by cult? As has been stated many times, Jim Jones' clan had a stack of bodies for the world to notice. How deep is the guilt of the WT?
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patio34
What a(nother) coincidence! Thanks for the good thread, ARoarer.
In the past 10 minutes I was reading in a psychology book how in the West, there seems to be a condition known as the basic fault. This is thought to stem from psychic remnants of absence in one form or another in the family during childhood (earlier childhood) that concretizes into habitual behavior in the adult. (Thoughts without a Thinker--psychotherapy fro a buddhist perspective by Mark Epstein, M.D.)
But it seems to me that the West's religious teaching (in general and JWs specifically) would either enhance or CAUSE this basic fault. Because of what you said about religious terrorism. When I was raised Catholic, it was that people would burn in hellfire if they weren't Catholic. It's the children that are especially endoctrinated.
Then one grows up with this fear that has formed behavior patterns when young & malleable. Though the beliefs have left, the habitual behaviors and some attitudes may be lingering.
Religions' contribution doesn't exactly correspond to the absence, but it may cause the same kind of problem in the adult.
Eastern religions don't teach (well Buddhism doesn't) that humans are inherently sinful and, in fact, don't have a concept of sin. They also teach about recognizing the "divine" that is in all humans rather than all humans being condemned unless they're "saved."
Pat
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Jomavrick
With regards the threatening nature the witness teachings impose upon those that would not be a part of the "organization", it is not unusual from most religions. On some level the ultimate fate that awaits humans according to most religious thought is divine condemnation, death, eternal damnation, becoming recycled into a tazmanian fruitfly if you do not meed the criteria as set out by the religion. From a practical perspective, leveraging fear is one of the only tools the religion has to keep the masses in line.
However the Witness imposition of thier views is to be certain more comprehensive and intrusive into every avenue of a persons life. Hence it is, in my opinion a very controlling religion. That can be a bad thing and it can be a good thing. Many people have a need to be controlled, have a need to be a part of an organization that projects such strong rules, perceptions thoughts on its followers. It does tend to strip a person of our god given ability to think independantly and express our own values and gifts in life.
I do not think that as a whole, Witnesses are a bad thing in most societies. The people do tend to be honest, strive to be moral and not a disruptive force in society. Thier noninvolvement with politics and local issues is obviously a deficiency, but I dont personally see the level of danger you were referring to with regards terrorism.
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ARoarer
Jomavrick, You say as a whole, Witnesses are honest and don't pose a threat to society, and that may be somewhat true on some levels, however, although the Watchtower is not an active terrorist, it does try to control through messages that are threatening and terrorizing and completely dishonest. The violent pictures have terrorized children for almost a century. Although other religions have fear based teachings such as hellfire, it really is not actively preached to the extent Watchtower does. In fact most people in other religions think of themselves as going to heaven, or when they lose a member of the family, the children are told they are in heaven with God. WT condems the world and all the non Jws and thier children to a violent death that is depicted in graphic pictures along with the threat that if you do not go along with this thought you will be shunned and treated as if you are already dead. The fear of this is damaging. Fear of everything. Their belief is a threat to the fabric of normal healthy relationships, whether between husband and wife, parents and children, jw students and "worldly classmates", and educators, and thier communities.
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ARoarer
Jomavrick, You say as a whole, Witnesses are honest and don't pose a threat to society, and that may be somewhat true on some levels, however, although the Watchtower is not an active terrorist, it does try to control through messages that are threatening and terrorizing and completely dishonest. The violent pictures have terrorized children for almost a century. Although other religions have fear based teachings such as hellfire, it really is not actively preached to the extent Watchtower does. In fact most people in other religions think of themselves as going to heaven, or when they lose a member of the family, the children are told they are in heaven with God. WT condems the world and all the non Jws and thier children to a violent death that is depicted in graphic pictures along with the threat that if you do not go along with this thought you will be shunned and treated as if you are already dead. The fear of this is damaging. Fear of everything. Their belief is a threat to the fabric of normal healthy relationships, whether between husband and wife, parents and children, jw students and "worldly classmates", and educators, and thier communities.
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Hamas
True, Witnesses are peaceful, and maybe as you say they do not pose a threat.
However, at a talk a bethel speaker told the crowds :
If the king tells us to jump, our only response would be : HOW HIGH ?!?
The link to this audio file is down right now, but I will keep trying to post it.
They are peaceful, but if the 'king' (FDS) told them to do something fanatical, they would have to.
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be wise
ARoarer,
Absolutely! I have never been more convinced of the damage the WTS does to children - I know this from experience. I see this harm being done to my nieces and nephews RIGHT NOW in exactly the same way - I only hope as they get older they can undo the harm cos I will be there for them as they do get older and start asking questions. Even if they don’t I will make sure the little time I have with them is well spent. I wouldn’t fill them with any sort of crap like the WTS does I would just ask them questions to open up there minds and get them thinking for themselves.
Personally I don’t think doctrine even comes into it – the fact that the Jehovah's Witness religion is involved in this sort of behaviour they pass as ‘teaching’ is disgusting enough. Btw, I was reading that book the other day and it only confirmed my convictions of the WTS -demons are everywhere kiddies be afraid be very afraid but they think it's OK because the chapter after it is how God will protect them against all these demons that are out to get them that are 'roaming the earth' - how thoughtful.