by Gorbatchov 26 Replies latest jw friends

  • JW_Rogue
    The Saturday drama impressed me. Of course, there is a lot to say about the organization, this professional produced movie in a "true story" scenario, gave me the insight that hope is important for suffering people. Hope is better than no hope.
    I know that the movie was made to create this effect on people.
    It's not a bad thought, that hope is better than no hope, and this idea is still between my ears.

    Hope isn't the problem, even false hope can be a comfort for a grieving person. The problem is that WT inserts itself into the equation so that the person's hope is based entirely around serving the WT and it's interest. Who wouldn't want to see their dead relatives again? Unlike other religions though JWs teach that only loyal JWs will be able to entertain that idea.

    Taken on it's own the drama didn't have a bad message but in the context of the rest of the convention it was clearly toxic and manipulative.

  • BluesBrother

    I enjoyed Gorby's balanced view , and if he found parts of the Convention good then I agree, we should not be afraid to say so.

    I thought it was about Loyalty, ostensibly to God but in reality to the WTS..However, hope is it it still good even if it is false hope? I don't think so. False hope is a lie and misleads the believer into making the wrong decisions . I would rather face reality.

  • steve2

    Hope as a substitute for reality-checking is hype. Even JWs would assert as much.

    In fact, perhaps more so in their heyday of growth than nowadays, they wasted no time bluntly dismantling other people's "false" hope and installing JW styled "happily ever afters". Level of smugness does not alter the dubiousness of such hope. Feeling good becomes more important than fact-checking and requires leaving your brain outside the Kingdom Hall. Just don't look at yourself in the mirror.

    When hope closes minds and gives breath to prejudice and judgementtalism, it has outlived any value it might have. Unless of course you consider pleasant dreams preferable to a dreary life - which is the lot of many rank and file. Even a terminally ill patient may feel better being told the prognosis is good - it devalues the patient's right to know the truth whilst providing hope and cruelty in equal measure. If you value hope over truth, withholding correct prognoses can feel justified. Marx' comment about 'religion being the opium of the masses' is as true today as it was when it was first uttered in the 19th Century.

  • xjwsrock

    I understand your point, Gorby. I thought similar things when attending the convention, that is, that people sometimes need a hope to cling to when facing terrible obstacles. The convention did a good job presenting multiple scenarios where a person would rather have the JW hope than to be left with no hope at all.

    Think about this though.... Why did they spend so much time and money creating fictional tales of doom and gloom to present life at its worst? ... answer - to bring up emotional needs in the attendees. It was basically done to scare the attendees into staying in the organization. I mean who wants to face these possible scary life circumstances without the security blanket of JW hope?

    Unfortunately, the JW "hope" is not just a sweet little "hope" that can make us feel better when life gets rough. It is bait that lures people into a CULT - into a life of sacrificed time, talent, opportunity, relationships, and medical care. All of which is demanded in order to earn this "hope".

    Here is a post I wrote on the subject if interested (just substitute Hope for Belief ):

    Belief and Faith Are Just Emotional Words for Ideas and Opinions


    I realized while sitting there in the convention, that this precious hope that is so important is simply the use of positive thinking to avoid overwhelming negative emotions.

    I can come up with some positive thinking on my own that doesn't come with a cult attached to it.

  • ttdtt

    You think it's admirable to use emotional blackmail and use the tricks any charismatic cult leader or Ad Man uses to get people to feel or to do what they don't want to do?

    Remember their proposed hope is based on doing whatever the GB tells you to do including not living a normal life. That is not hope worthy of a human.

    Also, for many time is running out on when there will be no amount of Overlapping Generations to get push this Cult forward.

    Then what do all these people with a false hope that kept them from productive lives and enriching human relationships do?

  • redvip2000

    Knowing that not everybody is happy with my conclusion, I write this because when they earn credits, they have to get them. Isn't it?

    There is nothing wrong with admitting that Sam Herd or any other Jdub can have a good talk about any specific subject.

    Every Sunday as I'm sipping on some coffee and flipping through the TV channels i sometimes come across Joel Osteen's talks. He is one of the best speakers I've ever heard, and his talks are engaging, motivating and heartfelt. But deep down i know it's all bull$hit. Sometimes i still listen for the entertainment factor, and so can you.

  • closed

    Gorby. I wish you all the best. And I am sure you will be fine whatever happens to you. You are level headed chap. If it's good - it's good good. Doesn't matter what's the source.

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