by Mikejw 6 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
There is a new trinity teaching that says Jesus is a separate person but at the same time all three are one.
https://youtu.be/JDOK0gedjAU?si=BBdwoPRDPzvzWkfz
This is basically the same as Watchtower teach that Jesus is so much like his father in every way that you could almost call them the same.
Things have changed from when I was pioneering with the old trinity brochure
Agree, it's beginning to be the same to Watchtower, Jesus has all the attributes of God, but isn't YHVH...
I was asked to prove to a religious couple I was studying with, to prove Jesus is Michael. As I researched the publications, I found that they had used weasel words that made it seem possible but not actual. "Aside from Michael, no archangel is mentioned in the Bible, nor do the Scriptures use the term "archangel" in the plural. The Bible describes Michael as the archangel, implying that he alone bears that designation. Hence, it is reasonable to conclude that Jehovah God has delegated to one, and only one, of his heavenly creatures full authority over all other angels"
Evidently, that angel was Michael—Jesus in his prehuman existence
Michael, referred to by some religions as “Saint Michael,” is evidently a name given to Jesus before and after his life on earth.
Consider why it is reasonable to conclude that Jesus is the archangel Michael.
The WTS then tries to stitch together various scriptures trying to give a "scriptural" basis for their belief, but instead shows it is not clearly stated and is very confusing. I doubt the average jw could begin to explain it using the bible, to a non-jw. I could not. One more crack in my thinking that the WTS had the "truth."
Obviously Jesus is Michael as Rev 12:7 "war broke out in heaven: Miʹcha·el and his angels battled with the dragon"
Gen 3:15 "And I will put enmity between you and the woman and between your offspring and her offspring. He will crush your head, and you will strike him in the heel.”"
The seed crushing the serpent in the head is Jesus. Thus Michael is doing Jesus' job.
Rattigan350:
You are doing something JWs commonly do, which is mix up two very old Christian doctrines, namely the Protoevangelium, and the other which is actually the Catholic and Greek Orthodox interpretation/devotion involving St. Michael the Archangel--which Watchtower leans on when trying to defend its "Jesus=Michael" doctrine.
The idea that Genesis 3:15 is some type of prediction of Jesus' coming is a teaching stretching back to the late Church Fathers called the Protoevangelium or the "First Gospel." The doctrine is that Mary is the "woman," Jesus is the "seed," and the Devil is the "serpent." It is not a Jewish teaching as there is no belief in Satan the Devil in Judaism.
Revelation 12:7 deals with an entirely different serpent, namely Leviathan, as Revelation is using Jewish tropes, not Christian ones. The Protoevangelium was first established in 180 CE, the late 2nd century, by Irenaeus, and Revelation was written around 95-96 CE, the late 1st century. So the "original serpent" could not have been the idea of Irenaeus' Protoevangelium as it had not yet been invented when Revelation was written. The author had to have something else in mind as this was a doctrine to come later after the book came about.
So before this Christian doctrine was created, the only other "original serpent" there could be (since the Jews did not believe that Genesis chapter 3 was Satan the Devil") was "leviathan" of Isaiah 27:1. Of this scholars are in agreement. Just do an Internet search and you will see that academics agree that this is the actual connection:
We know that Revelation is not recalling the snake in Eden because the source of John’s language isn’t Genesis, it’s Isaiah. Along with calling the devil a “serpent” (ophis; ὄφις), Revelation 12:9 describes Satan as a “dragon” (drakon; δράκων) three times. The only other verse in all of Scripture that describes a creature as both a “dragon” and a “serpent” in this way is Isaiah 27:1, and the creature is the primordial sea-monster known as Leviathan. The Isaiah verse appears in the context of God's eschatological battle against evil, which is the very same context that readers encounter in Revelation when Michael and his angels confront Satan (see Rev 12:7-9). According to the Greek translation of the Hebrew Bible, Isaiah 27:1 states, “In that day God shall bring a holy and great and strong sword against the dragon (drakon; δράκων), the serpent (ophis; ὄφις) that flees, upon the dragon (drakon; δράκων), the twisting serpent (ophis; ὄφις): [God] shall destroy the dragon (drakon; δράκων).” Revelation 12:9 contains the same threefold repetition of "dragon" that appears in Isaiah 27:1, and both verses repeat the word alongside "serpent" in the context of divine battle. Therefore, we can be confident that Isaiah 27:1 is the verse to which Revelation refers in its description of heavenly war against Satan.--Which "Serpent" Is Satan? Israel Bible Center.
Watchtower leans upon Catholic views of Michael as a warrior against the Devil, usually with a sword and the main leader of God's forces against Satan popular in the main public's view, to play on the religiously uneducated to suggest that only Jesus Christ could play this part in God's plan.
The famous prayer to St. Michael the Archangel is quite unknown to Jehovah's Witnesses, but it sounds like actions that only Jesus Christ would play as one conquering the Devil:
St. Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle, be our protection against the wickedness and snares of the devil. May God rebuke him we humbly pray; and do thou, O Prince of the Heavenly host, by the power of God, cast into hell Satan and all the evil spirits who prowl about the world seeking the ruin of souls. Amen.
Watchtower doctrine is "mushed-up" beliefs of Christology, mistaken identities, and uneducated Bible look-ups with a little popular mythology added in since no one seems to know any better.
(IMHO, JWs are often too afraid to purchase or read one of Christendom's or Judaism's Bibles for fear "evil" or academia might "rub off" on them--but they would just learn the above if they did. This isn't something you would learn in a college course, just from a sidebar or a footnote in your average Bible.)
For those interested in more on Leviathan, and the Chaos Conflict Myth, then this great thread by the Poster "Leolaia" is informative, she no longer Posts here sadly.
https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/68098/skinny-on-leviathan-rahab-monsters
" JWs are often too afraid to purchase or read one of Christendom's or Judaism's Bibles for fear "evil" or academia might "rub off" on them--but they would just learn the above if they did. "
You have touched there P.S. upon how deep the mind control goes. This was sadly my experience to a degree. From an early age I wished to gain a greater understanding of the Scriptures, and so purchased Commentaries on every Bible Book, and was not afraid to read them, but being a born-in, the mind control made me dismiss the obvious, and not draw correct conclusions.
For example, I had a couple of Commentaries on "Daniel", both pointed out that it was written just prior to 164 BCE, but my indoctrinated mind dismissed that as wrong ! very sadly. I do think that reading those Scholarly Books helped in my gradual awakening though.
It was only a short time after my initial Epiphany that I began to take as the default position that the JW org. view on any Scripture was wrong, and work back from that position, rarely was my default position confounded !
The Org's Eisegetical approach to Scripture means they ARE wrong about "Michael" and most other things, and their explanation of the Divinity of Christ is far from nuanced or full, and they do not seem to understand, or pretend not to, what the Trinity Doctrine is and why the Church Fathers and later others eventually, naturally, based upon Scripture, brought it about.
