by NotFormer 8 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • NotFormer

    Is it very different from the old version?

    Has it changed much?

    How can I get a copy? A hard copy, that is. The JWs sometimes have a trolley/cart in my local town centre. Could they get me a copy? Would they charge me for it, or expect a "donation"?

    I could possibly call the local congregation but I don't want to end up on their radar.

  • NotFormer

    Damn! This was an unintentional repost; I thought the first one wasn't going through.

  • slimboyfat

    What people consider the “controversial” renderings in the NWT remain pretty much intact in the revision (John 1.1, Col 1.16, Luke 23.43, use of “Jehovah” in the New Testament, and so on). But the language has been thoroughly modernised and some of the quirky aspects have been toned down or eliminated (“time indefinite”, all the “proceeded to”s, auxiliary verbs generally, “soul” for every instance of nephesh and psyche, for example). A few changes do reflect changes in teaching over the decades, such as the reinstatement of “elder”, in place of the original NWT rendering “older man”, which dates from a period when JWs didn’t have bodies of elders as they have then now. The difference in the revised NWT is perhaps most pronounced in places such as the book of Job, Proverbs, and poetic parts of the prophets where there has been a real effort to make the language understandable rather than literal. (The “dungy idols” have been removed for example)

    The JWs at the carts probably won’t have a spare copy to hand but if you express an interest in obtaining one they may arrange to bring one for you or else direct you to come along to the KH to pick one up at one of the meeting times.

    It is of course also available online in full on their website.

  • FFGhost

    Sometimes they do have them at the carts, but if you ask for one, expect to be grilled over and over again about why you want one. They are instructed only to give them to "sincere" people.

    The reasoning is, since there is no manner of donating for it at the cart *, they don't want to be "giving away" something that would be easily the most "expensive" item they have to offer. So if they do hand one out, they will check to make sure you are "rightly disposed".

    * JWs are instructed not to handle money at the carts, which is actually pretty smart, imagine the safety issue if nefarious types knew JWs have $$$ at the carts.

  • no-zombie

    I'd say that there are some considerable differences between the NWT and NNWT, so much so that I think of the NNWT as Jehovah's Witnesses' GOOD NEWS bible.

    In actuality the NNWT (despite its ongoing online updates) is really the third generational version Witnesses use. The first being the green editions, the black second version and what we have today ... being the grey/silver one.

    As we know the NWT was originally released as a series of volumes from 1953. And I do consider them to be a rather good 'word for word' translation barring the decision to insert the word JEHOVAH into the Christian Greek scriptures, where there is clearly no authority for them to do so. In fact it is clear that the use of JEHOVAH in some verses was inserted to "clarify" or shape their meaning, which runs foul of REV. 22:19.

    The second iteration was released in 1984. This was the first leather bound, traditional looking Bible, which Witness took into the ministry and honestly, it something that many took pride in using. It was well bound and had a easy to read font. However, the unfortunate tradition to include the use of the word JEHOVAH was only expanded in the New Testament.

    Finally, we have the third attempt by the 'Faithful Slave' to produce a copy of the Bible, offered in 2013.

    While some would say that it was easier to read (which I doubt its relevance, as I still consider the 1611 King James as quite understandable if you want to put the smallest of effort into it), the publishers once again decided to move further away from the word-for-word concept of Bible translation and go with a more looser text. This allowed them to make modifications that colored it's wordings to reflect Watchtower doctrine. Case in point, is the word SOUL, which has now been almost completely removed from the NNWT. Another example can be seen is the revisions and inclusions of words to reflect the concept of a 'governing body' in the first century. To my mind, this is inexcusable for people who claim other Bible translations, as tainted.

    In summery, the NNWT is a poorer version, for those people who wish to have a translation that attempts to reflect the original manuscripts because it has shown over time, to value prose over textual accuracy.

    Of course it only my opinion ... and who am I? Not spirit anointed Governing Body member with an expert handle on the Hebrew and Greek languages, that for sure.

  • Journeyman

    As someone has has no claim to being any kind of Hebrew or Greek scholar, I broadly feel that there is something more bland and soulless (nepheshless? pardon the pun) about the 2013 RNWT (Revised NWT, as I think of it).

    The supposed benefit of more 'up-to-date' language is over-rated IMO, especially when accompanied by the general dumbing down of all the other teaching and meeting material from the org. What's wrong with encouraging readers to learn a bit more, improve themselves and stretch their linguistic knowledge rather than 'lowering' the standard of a text to the lowest common denominators? What next? Slang, street talk and gender-neutral pronouns?

    The language of the 1950s-80s NWT, while perhaps a bit dated in places now, is a good compromise between the old texts of the likes of the KJV (which I do agree is less relevant today, and besides, is not really that accurate a translation by today's standards), and the contemporary free-translations of recent decades. It retained enough of the poetry and symbolic language of the text to provide colour and meaning, without being too obscure or complex in language or too far removed from the contemporary vernacular.

    Now, the RNWT is too far in the opposite direction and as some have said, too many important contextual footnotes have been removed (eg: nephesh/soul, hades/sheol/grave, etc), and expressions and possible alternate or modern renderings have been interpolated directly into the text to lean towards current GB teaching and JW terminology. "Older men" to "elders" being just one example.

    Also, working against the GB's claim of wanting to improve readability, some features which actually made understanding easier in the previous NWT have been removed, such as the plural YOU which was a useful feature, and the removal of which was never explained.

  • NotFormer

    I never thought of the cash handling aspect.

    It's an interesting situation in this town. Not only do the dubs have a literature rack, but so do other groups. The Open Brethren have a table, giving away not just tracts, but full copies of the NKJV. There's even a bloke with a table set up to sell socialist literature and books. This usually happens on Saturday. A few times I've seen another group that I assume is not the Brethren because they have Gideon bibles, a guitar and are singing much more modern choruses than what the Brethren usually sing at the their services. I think they're from the main Pentecostal church in town.

    Perhaps I could appeal to their pride: "There are so many people giving away bibles, but I have heard that yours is the most accurate and true to the original souces!" 😁😆

  • Phizzy

    " It is of course also available online in full on their website." Thanks SBF, you don't have to go to the website then the NWT, just type in the Book Chapter & Verses and you will be taken to the relevant place in the NWT, its still on the JW site, but quicker.

  • fastJehu


    Some years ago our member @MeanMrMustard made an unbelievably large effort to compare NWTs.

    Compare NWT 1984 vs 2013:

    Later he made the same "job" with comparing the WT library 2011 vs 2012:

Share this