Hi folks. I have been a lurker here for quite some time but I have now decided to make my first post. I am originally from somewhere on the East Coast, but recently, in part to aid in the fading process, I have moved to a city somewhere West of the Mississippi. At the moment I am still a member of the cong. back home where my family is, and my publisher's card is still there. I've decided that it would probably be best to have my card formally transferred to a cong. here in my new town so that my family back home doesn't worry too much about me becoming inactive. Once I have everything transferred I don't intend to go to the new cong. more than once or twice so based on what I have read here and elsewhere it looks like a PO Box and a prepaid cell phone would be useful tools to have. All of that said, I was wondering about something. There a few stories about people hijacking the transfer process and intercepting the card(s) and the letter. I was wondering about a possible twist on that. Apparently you would recruit somebody to impersonate the secretary from the new cong. who would then call the old cong. and ask for the card, and letter of introduction to be mailed to an address that you control. That seems kind of risky because the secretary at the old cong. might balk if he's asked to mail the stuff somewhere that he can't confirm as being a legitimate address of a K.H. Well then why not find a real cong. at a real K.H. in some random city and have everything sent there? First you could call some random cong. in say, Minneapolis using a disposable cell phone and find out the real name of the secretary and write the name down. Let’s pretend his name is Fred Flintstone. You could then have your impersonator call the old cong. spoof the caller ID, and claim to be secretary Fred Flintstone from the cong. in Minneapolis and request the card and letter be mailed to the real street address of that K.H. The stuff would then show up in Minneapolis, a city where I will probably never live and just sit in a file cabinet forever. Does anybody think this could work?
Moving and transferring publisher's card.
I think that would have been possible in the past before elders had access to other congregation information via the JW website. Although I resigned before the website came to be used as significantly as it is today, my understanding is that the COBE or secretary can go online and find the official mailing address of the congregation secretary at any new congregation you may claim to be moving to.
Using Minneapolis as the example, I would suggest visiting a Cong in St. Paul for several visits, meet the secretary and ask him to have your cards transferred from the old Cong. I believe the new arrangement is that the new secretary must request your cards from your old Cong. Once your cards arrive, disappear and toss the burner phone. Good luck ....Doc
Hi The Fugitive
Does anybody think this could work?
No, your cards will very likely be sent back to your original congregation, which will then 'red flag' it to the secretary in the original congregation who is then much more likely to, at the very least, informally check with your family, it'll not just look weird, it'll also look questionable....
I believe the new arrangement is that the new secretary must request your cards from your old Cong.
BoE letter: November 17, 2010 - "Re: Letters of introduction"
If the previous service committee knows where the publisher moved, they may take the initiative and send these items without waiting for a formal request from the new congregation.https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwqmWMK7dwtlYzZGZU9qTF9PUE0/view
No, your cards will very likely be sent back to your original congregation
If someone were transfer several times through a series of congregations from say congregation A then to congregation B and to C then D etc. would the secretary at congregation D be able to tell from the publisher's cards and letter of introduction that he receives in the mail that the person originally came from congregation A? Is it possible that if the person disappears or just never shows up that the secretary then mail everything back to congregation A based on the assumption that the person's family is there?
If someone were transfer several times through a series of congregations from say congregation A then to congregation B and to C then D etc. would the secretary at congregation D be able to tell from the publisher's cards and letter of introduction that he receives in the mail that the person originally came from congregation A? Would the secretary then mail everything back to congregation A based on the assumption that the person's family is there?
Making the move to 2 or 3 Congs would certainly give you "an edge" in your efforts of disappearing. The success of that depends on the diligence of the Cong Secretaries involved. Many of these men are burned out or incompetent (although COBEs and Sect's are usually the "sharpest" of the lot) and they may just not bother tracking down your history.
So move from "Home" to Cong A for a few months. Attend sporadically. Then move across town (or further -- at least to a different Circuit) to Cong B. Attend a little. Be absent more. Drop off the scene.
You will have greater success if you are a little "odd". Congs are anxious to have new members that are "normal", attractive, successful people. Best to have lots of problems, esp financial problems. Don't drive your new BMW. Wear misfitting clothes that don't match well. Don't brush your teeth. Ask about young (even underage) daughters of Elders as if you're interested in taking them out on date. Make yourself such that they are GLAD you're not making meetings. Good luck! . . . . Doc
If someone were transfer several times through a series of congregations for say congregation A then to congregation B and to C then D etc. would congregation D be able to tell from the publisher's cards and letter of introduction that are mailed to them that the person originally came from congregation A and then mail everything back there
Your OP implied that with this second route you would not be turning up at the congregation at all - just choosing a 'random congregation'
Therefore, why would B send to C?
If B did send to C - without seeing you, seeing you a couple of times only, seeing you for a short time (ie they don't know you well enough to write a letter of introduction) - B will probably either include letter of introduction from A in letter to C and/or will let C know you originally came from A. B might even refuse to send to C and send back to A for them to send to C themselves.
based on the assumption that the person's family is there?
No assumption is made - your cards arrive at B, you don't turn up, B gets rid of your cards by posting back to A - B doesn't know you, B isn't making any assumptions, they're just getting rid of your cards from their file (of course they could telephone or email A, effectively same result) - A wonders why your cards have been returned to them.
Does anybody think this could work?
No, I don't think that would work because of the Internet and the many other ways of verifying information and statements made.
However, what you did, moving to a different congregation where nobody knows you to start fading, doesn't need such convoluted scheme. trust me, I know; that's exactly what I did in my case. I left one congregation and remember going to the new KH once or twice, talked to an elder and pretty much disappeared.
Many elders are overworked and are happy to slack as much as possible. I faded from the new congregation where nobody missed me and had my records transferred (and the elders at the previous congregation had a lot to say about me).
My suggestion is do the transfer and remain as anonymous and disconnected from people in the new congregation. That's all I had to do and it worked. It may work with you too.
Hi The Fugitive and welcome to the forum!
My older daughter moved across town, told the old kh she was going to start attending a diff one. Went to a few meetings at the new one. Told a few people who inquired, that she was liking the new one.
Then quit going altogether. Nobody ever said a thing to her!