Cult or Religion

by Richard C B 225 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • stuffwotifink
    stuffwotifink
    I think what im trying to say is many have misinterpreted the religion which has caused them harm
    Bro, I'm not trying to be funny... But all you are doing is repeating the claim that there is a "true" interpretation (now of the religion, not bible), and they don't have it.
    To make that statement you would have to have it yourself.
    Do you?

    And for the third time: Do you not consider the GB to be a composite charismatic leader?
    I do - which sort of answers the question in regards to being a cult - for me.
  • Finkelstein
    Finkelstein

    What is a cult and what is a religion? Its open to debate. Who has the authority to say for certain what is a cult and what is a religion?

    In general one could define the deference between an identity of a cult and a religion by the amount of behavioral sociological control over the devoted adherents, the JWs gets recognized more as a cult because it has a high amount of internal control over its followers. .

    All religions are essentially cults, its just how extreme those controls are over the adherents to the religion.

    This has been posted before but its relevant information concerning mind control tactics and defining what is

    a recognized cult. .......... by Steve Hassan

    I've highlighted specific elements pertaining to the JWS

    1. Regulate individual’s physical reality
    2. Dictate where, how, and with whom the member lives and associates or isolates
    3. When, how and with whom the member has sex
    4. Control types of clothing and hairstyles
    5. Regulate diet - food and drink, hunger and/or fasting
    6. Manipulation and deprivation of sleep
    7. Financial exploitation, manipulation or dependence
    8. Restrict leisure, entertainment, vacation time
    9. Major time spent with group indoctrination and rituals and/or self indoctrination including the Internet
    10. Permission required for major decisions
    11. Thoughts, feelings, and activities (of self and others) reported to superiors
    12. Rewards and punishments used to modify behaviors, both positive and negative
    13. Discourage individualism, encourage group-think
    14. Impose rigid rules and regulations
    15. Instill dependency and obedience

    Information Control

    1. Deception:
    a. Deliberately withhold information
    b. Distort information to make it more acceptable
    c. Systematically lie to the cult member

    2. Minimize or discourage access to non-cult sources of information, including:
    a. Internet, TV, radio, books, articles, newspapers, magazines, other media
    b.Critical information
    c. Former members
    d. Keep members busy so they don’t have time to think and investigate
    e. Control through cell phone with texting, calls, internet tracking
    3. Compartmentalize information into Outsider vs. Insider doctrines
    a. Ensure that information is not freely accessible
    b.Control information at different levels and missions within group
    c. Allow only leadership to decide who needs to know what and when

    4. Encourage spying on other members
    a. Impose a buddy system to monitor and control member
    b.Report deviant thoughts, feelings and actions to leadership
    c. Ensure that individual behavior is monitored by group
    5. Extensive use of cult-generated information and propaganda, including:
    a. Newsletters, magazines, journals, audiotapes, videotapes, YouTube, movies and other media

    b.Misquoting statements or using them out of context from non-cult sources
    6. Unethical use of confession
    a. Information about sins used to disrupt and/or dissolve identity boundaries
    b. Withholding forgiveness or absolution
    c. Manipulation of memory, possible false memories

    Thought Control

    1. Require members to internalize the group’s doctrine as truth
    a. Adopting the group's ‘map of reality’ as reality
    b. Instill black and white thinking
    c. Decide between good vs. evil
    d. Organize people into us vs. them (insiders vs. outsiders)
    2.Change person’s name and identity
    3. Use of loaded language and clichés which constrict knowledge, stop critical thoughts and reduce complexities into platitudinous buzz words
    4. Encourage only ‘good and proper’ thoughts
    5. Hypnotic techniques are used to alter mental states, undermine critical thinking and even to age regress the member
    6. Memories are manipulated and false memories are created
    7. Teaching thought-stopping techniques which shut down reality testing by stopping negative thoughts and allowing only positive thoughts, including:
    a. Denial, rationalization, justification, wishful thinking
    b. Chanting
    c. Meditating
    d. Praying
    e. Speaking in tongues
    f. Singing or humming
    8. Rejection of rational analysis, critical thinking, constructive criticism
    9. Forbid critical questions about leader, doctrine, or policy allowed
    10. Labeling alternative belief systems as illegitimate, evil, or not useful

    Emotional Control

    1. Manipulate and narrow the range of feelings – some emotions and/or needs are deemed as evil, wrong or selfish
    2. Teach emotion-stopping techniques to block feelings of homesickness, anger, doubt
    3. Make the person feel that problems are always their own fault, never the leader’s or the group’s fault
    4. Promote feelings of guilt or unworthiness, such as
    a. Identity guilt
    b. You are not living up to your potential
    c. Your family is deficient
    d. Your past is suspect
    e. Your affiliations are unwise
    f. Your thoughts, feelings, actions are irrelevant or selfish
    g. Social guilt
    h. Historical guilt

    5. Instill fear, such as fear of:
    a. Thinking independently
    b. The outside world

    c. Enemies
    d. Losing one’s salvation
    e. Leaving or being shunned by the group
    f. Other’s disapproval
    6. Extremes of emotional highs and lows – love bombing and praise one moment and then declaring you are horrible sinner
    7. Ritualistic and sometimes public confession of sins
    8. Phobia indoctrination: inculcating irrational fears about leaving the group or questioning the leader’s authority
    a. No happiness or fulfillment possible outside of the group
    b. Terrible consequences if you leave: hell, demon possession, incurable diseases, accidents, suicide, insanity, 10,000 reincarnations, etc.
    c. Shunning of those who leave; fear of being rejected by friends, peers, and family
    d. Never a legitimate reason to leave; those who leave are weak, undisciplined, unspiritual, worldly, brainwashed by family or counselor, or seduced by money, sex, or rock and roll

    e. Threats of harm to ex-member and family
  • Viviane
    Viviane
    No one here could say jesus was a charismatic cult leader if they studied his life. That is the contradiction

    Uh, that's exactly what Jesus was.

  • StarTrekAngel
    StarTrekAngel

    Within the realm of spirituality, Jesus could be defined as a charismatic cult leader in the sense of the dictionary meaning of the word.

    Lets put in context. Assuming you are a believer now or putting yourself in the shoes of a believer in the times of Jesus, he had ways to show the source of his authority as a cult leader. None of the modern religious leaders of today have such proof and that is where the word "cult" takes on a different meaning than just plain worship of something or somebody.

  • Richard C B
    Richard C B

    @stuffwyt,, ok ill try to make my point more clearer for you, but firstly i dont know enough about the GB to make an educated opinion so i will have to put that to one side.

    The point when applied to an organised religion is ppl misinterpret what they are taught and put themselves under inmence pressure which could lead one to become depressed etc. which I agree is dangerous. hence the misinterpretation of the religion upon leaving the religion the weight of oppression they have put on themslves is gradually removed and they become more balanced in there life on later reflection they then start to resent there time in the religion and believe they where mentally conditioned which caused them harm thus they believe it to be a cult.

    so my point is that it is sometimes self inflicted

  • stuffwotifink
    stuffwotifink
    If you don't know enough about the leaders of the religion to comment upon them - Perhaps you are in no place to judge if the religion is a cult or not.
    (and this thread becomes pointless. Go research the GB.)

    Just a thought.

    I'll respectfully leave your other point. Either you don't understand me, or I don't understand you. But we're speaking past each other.
    Peace out.
  • StarTrekAngel
    StarTrekAngel

    No way Mr Richard. Not long ago during one of the hottest days of the summer, I decided I was not going to wear a coat to the Sunday meeting. I pulled it out of the closet at first and then turn it back in. My wife looked at me and asked why... I said it too hot, I am not going to suffer it. She replied.. just take it off when you step inside. I said... the heat OUTSIDE is what I am trying to avoid. The temp inside the KH is fine. She replied.. well take it in your hand, put it on before you enter and then take it off when you sit down.

    Now you tell me if the above has anything to do with perception, because there are plenty of personal stories like mine that have no logical explanation and don't fit your idea of a merely "perceived cult"

  • cofty
    cofty
    No one here could say jesus was a charismatic cult leader if they studied his life - RCB

    Jesus enticed men to abandon their wives, children and businesses to follow him around Palestine preaching that he was going to come in power in their lifetime and cast everybody who didn't believe in him into an eternal fire.

    How is that not a dangerous cult leader?

  • Richard C B
    Richard C B
    @stuffwyt peace to you also
  • Viviane
    Viviane
    The point when applied to an organised religion is ppl misinterpret what they are taught and put themselves under inmence pressure which could lead one to become depressed etc. which I agree is dangerous. hence the misinterpretation of the religion upon leaving the religion the weight of oppression they have put on themslves is gradually removed and they become more balanced in there life on later reflection they then start to resent there time in the religion and believe they where mentally conditioned which caused them harm thus they believe it to be a cult.

    So your point is victim blaming? Yeah, go sell that crazy somewhere else.

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