pope exonerates god

by waton 9 Replies latest social current

  • waton

    At least for you personally,

    The Pope, ex cathedra?, infallibly?* has changes the wording of the Lord's prayer from "-lead us not into temptation -" to -let us not fall into temptation."* "what you have bound on Earth, will have been bound in heaven!"

    Creating outrage among theologians that had god rightly complicit in temptations, like:

    Planting tempting trees himself, authorizing the killing of Job's kids , Leading Jesus via HS into the wilderness temptation trap.

    Now, we are asking god to be proactive, prevent the trip-ping.

    Poof-, is gone part of the wt's universal sovereignty issue.

    Thank you Francis.

  • waton

    so, if wt changed the baptism ritual from "In the name of the father, the Son an the HS, to "in the name of the organization, why cant the Pope change the Lords prayer? both are just bible passages? right?

  • smiddy3

    i wonder how many different interpretations of the many scriptures of the Bible have occurred with the many different translations of the bible ,knowing of course that not all Bibles have the same books in them .

    It all depends on what brand of Christianity you adhere to.And their are 40 000 + for you to choose from.

    So much for Gods word to be infallible . Human beings are changing words and meanings all of the time for hundreds of years and God stays silent not correcting any point of view or endorsing any.

  • Finkelstein

    Good point smiddy3 , yet most people dont realize that when they start to study the bible with an organization such as the JWS.

  • waton

    The Pope's edict was about temptation, how active "God" is in it.

    One way and another, dont be led or fall for the temptation to study the tall "fall" story.

    Stories have a way to prove to be just that, even if they are based on talking snakes, asses.


    Changing scriptural interpretations is a necessity for accurate knowledge in my opinion. Reading the King James version in the 21st century does not translate accurately in today's vernacular, so an adjustment is correct.

    An example could be something as simple as changing 'betrothed' to 'engaged' like in the example of Joseph and Mary. Betrothed is a word that does not have a modern use in the west these days so engaged is probably a better word.

    As far as which list of biblical books to use, you have to ask 'How does one have the authority to decide which books belong and do not belong?'

    I go to the source. To the people who gave the world the bible and take their authority over someone else who has no such authority to decide which books to include or not include.

    For the record, I do not accept the WTS as an authentic source or authority...

    Who gave the world the bible again? Why was it written? To be a guide for Christianity or for some other reason?

  • smiddy3

    I go to the source. To the people who gave the world the bible and take their authority over someone else who has no such authority to decide which books to include or not include

    I find it curious to say the least that it is human beings who decide what is GOD`S word and what is not , and what books / Letters are to be included and what is not to be included,and we still have a discrepancy in Christendom as to how many books /letters constitute GOD`s word.

    I wonder how many of the books ,letters,scriptures that are left out of the Bible that maybe should be in there.?

    Some of which are even mentioned in the Bible .

    The book of Enoch ,the book of Jubilees ,The testament of Noah ,The book of Jasher .

    Yet GOD whose word the Bible supposedly contains , remains silent as to which if any truly contains his words or which books / letters make up the TRUE BIBLE .

    Why has he been so silent for thousands of years if it means life or death for humans to believe or not believe and act on his word.?

  • waton

    No doubt the Pope has the right to prescribe for his adherents the wording of the Our Father prayer and the Hail Maries. but

    To go from saying to God: " Please do not Lead us ----" to

    " Please do not let us fall----" is a big shift, --- beyond an the scope of updating to modern language, or a more accurate translation of the original words for 'lead' and 'fall'.

    For Catholics. God after all set up the first temptation, and allowed the fall, and

    For Jws: Would it not be a nice Petition addressed to your GOD, the Guardians Of Doctrine, your

    G overning b od y:

    "please, do not lead us--", enough is enough?

  • Earnest

    A couple of comments on this change.

    First of all, this change only applies to the Italian translation and the Pope is confirming the decison of the Italian bishops conference in November last year as Bishop of Rome; not speaking infallibly ex cathedra as Head of the Church. There is, at present, no intention to change the English although it is worth noting that the catholic New American Bible has read "...do not subject us to the final test" since 2002.

    Secondly, the Italian will be changed from ne nos indúcas in tentatiónem (lead us not into temptation) to non abbandonarci alla tentazione (do not abandon us to temptation).The reading "lead us not into temptation" originates not with the Greek but the Latin Vulgate translation "ne inducas nos in temptationem".

    The expression in the Greek is me eisenegkes hemas which verb elsewhere in the NT means "bring", so the NWT reads "...do not bring us [into temptation]" whatever that may mean.

  • waton
    NWT: "--do not bring us [into temptation]" whatever that may mean. Earnest

    Thank you for the exact details.

    Bringing is actually better than "leading." "Bringing" implies that the deity will provide transportation.

    Temptation is such a powerful control mechanism.

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