Very draining conversation.

by CC Ryder 9 Replies latest jw friends

  • CC Ryder
    CC Ryder

    Hi everyone,

    I had a very emotionally draining conversation over the phone with my mother yesterday. She is not a JW, she is a International Bible Student (Russelite). I have not got into such a deep conversation with her since I have been out of the Borg. I've always skirted and avoided it. You all know how easy it is to forget and get roped into one though. I called her to see how she and my father were doing (usual weekly check up call) and to see if she heard about the disaster with the Space Shuttle (which she didn't know about). After talking and trying to explain to her about what happened with the Shuttle we got onto War with Iraq and the unrest in Isreal. She believes in everything that Charles T. Russel ever wrote or stated. She and my Dad (an elder in his local KH here in Tn) never talk about religion, so, knowing I'm out, she always try's to "witness" to me when talking about such topics as "War with the Nations...ect."

    She say's things like, "see..Isreal is close to becoming restored according to the scriptures"...I ask..."what scriptures Mom?"..."Well all the know?"...I say.."No Ma..I don't know, because what I was taught by the WTS is totally different from what you believe"...and she uses that to launch into questions like..."You believe Jesus was our saviour don't you, and don't you think God is going to bring Armaggedon soon, and don't you see that we are living in the Great Trbulation?"...on and on....wheeeehhh!

    I always try to side-step my way through it until I can get the conversation back to a non-religeous topic. It's pretty frustating for me because what we were taught from the WTS and what Russel taught (before the "New Light and break-off occured) are TOTALLY on different ends of the spectrum. I have also been out of touch with Bible reading and have begun to forget alot of the JW doctrine, so I'm having a difficult time conversing with her on this subject, without getting frustrated. It's mentally draining to say the least!

    I tried to tell her how I feel. I feel that no one knows what God will exactly do, or how he is going to do it, but hopefully will remove wickedness, sickness, and death in his own time. I feel that he will read the hearts of every individual, past or present, and will Judge on that basis. I feel that belonging to an organized religion is not all that is required to be saved from his judgement. It's what is in a person's heart, deep within him, that God will search and examine.

    I told her that I do not feel right telling someone that what they believe in is wrong, she said.." you never did that.."...and I said..." Oh yes I did Mom, going from door-to-door with the literature from the WTS and saying the only way to salvation is through Jehovah's "organization", and saying that if your not in this organization you'll be destroyed at Armaggedon."...she then says..." well...yes...I suppose your right..but we have to be in either of two classes, both go to heaven but only one goes behind the veil as christs bride.." and I asked her " Isn't there anyone who will be on earth?" She say's " oh yes, those who were punished at Armaggedon and have hearts that are teachable among all mankind"...and I asked..." you mean JW's, Catholics, Mouslims...etc"..she say's "yes...thats right, and Isreal will become god's approved nation again." I've heard her go there before, and as many times as I hear it, I never seem to be amazed at how much it floors me.

    She seems to only agree with me when I expose the wrong thinking of the WTS, like the peadophile issue, but if I try to get her to see the way I personally feel on doctrinal teaching, she starts "witnessing" about the bride class, and entering behind the veil...ect. I really try to be patient with her, and I never raise my voice or speak in an angry tone, it's always respectfull, it just WEARS me out.

    It's hard to talk to her because she really doesn't know how to back up very much of what she say's. I've noticed that with alot of those in her group I've met in the past. Only a few of her "Older breathern" will show they have a deep background in the Bible. She usually sticks to one thing..."being in the bride class".

    Does anyone else have experience with a close relative or close friend who belongs to the group my Mom does? Any suggestions will help. I kind of know what y'all will recommend.."Stay clear of religeous topics". I've always wondered if anyone else has similar circumstances, I haven't met anyone yet who has, but I haven't asked anyone here until now.

  • copsec

    CC, I feel for you. After I was disfellowshipped, on the rare occasions that I got to speak to my mother, it was very draining as you say because she was always trying to get me back "into the fold." It got to where I didn't even want to talk to her and I started avoiding the few times I got too. What is bad about that is that she died not long after and I never got to tell her how much I loved her even with all the WT bullshit. So, while I can't really help you with your situation, I can tell you to never take it to heart so much that you quit talking to her cause you never know when the conversation you are having with her will be your last.

    BTW, thanks for your welcome on my other post!

  • Guest 77
    Guest 77

    Your conversation reminds of watching an old movie. My mom and I no longer talk about religion except for me bringing up the pedophile problem. I've made my peace with my mom and that's good enough for me. We get along better now than the past. I've tackled my problems and I'm at peace.

    Guest 77

  • CC Ryder
    CC Ryder

    Thanks and your welcome Copsec!

    Guest77, Thats one topic my mother agrees with me on. It's just that this time was the first in a long time that we got into it that heavy. I'm afraid that with current events escalating in the direction they are going, she'll bring it up more often.

    Copsec, No...I'll never let it get to the point of not talking to her. It's just draining. I was also curious if anyone out there knows or has the same situation.

    Thanks for your comments.


  • musky
    It's what is in a person's heart, deep within him, that God will search and examine.

    Exactly! I believe this too.

    I really try to be patient with her, and I never raise my voice or speak in an angry tone, it's always respectfull,

    Thats the best way to handle things, I feel. Nothing much good ever comes from yelling or getting very upset. Your mom may be thinking about what you say, more than you realize.

    Currently I am sidestepping my mom ( witness) when she brings up the religeon topic with me( raised witness, but not active). But I know that there will come a time, maybe soon when we will have a deep discussion again. Take care, And I hope all goes well with you and your mom.

  • Solace


    Im so sorry, I know what you are going through. Almost every conversation that I have with my JW family is draining, if its regarding religion. I can work and entire day and not be as exhausted as I am after conversing with them for only a couple of hours.

    Im beginning to think that they need to first be ready to hear the truth, or they just become angry and resentful of me for telling them anything at all. Its like we are both trying to convince eachother of something that the other doesnt believe, or just plain doesnt want to hear.

  • BluesBrother

    That is really unusuual, if I may say so, father an elder in the Borg, and mother a Russellite.

    How does your father cope and retain his position?

    Are there many of your mothers persuasion? I thought that they were long gone.

    I know how hard it is to deal with family that are just blinkered by the J W religion. Everything is seen as to how it fits with "Bible prophecy". No manner of reasoning will change their view. I am just "Too dim to see it.......corrupted by my friends on the internet..........must have an ulterior motive" etc. yada yada .....

  • CC Ryder
    CC Ryder

    Hi BluesBrother, Yes in was real interesting growing up. My father was studying with JW's when he met my mother were he worked. She was already associated with the Bible students from my Grand Mother who was a Polish Immagrant and became associated with them soon after arriving in this country. I think it was before the split, but I'm not sure and my mother doesn't know either. The brothers had advised that he not marry her, that was in 1951. He was baptised in 1950. My mother never changed, which was what my father was hoping. My sister and I attended both meetings, alternating, and they left it up to her and I to choose which place we would continue to go to. We both stuck with the Borg, although I don't remember making that dicision. My mother came with us to a few assemblies, the first of which was on their honeymoon at Yankee Stadium for that hugh assembly that the Borg always brags about.

    They never seemed to bother my Dad about it, however it did take him years before qualifying to be an elder. I think he has been an elder since 1973 or so, I don't recall. I can't say much about him hear because I do not want to jeopordize him in any way, I'll just say he's a cool guy and was a great father. Never pushed me to do the JW thing at all. He is now 80 years old and is limited to his involvement due to poor health and old age.

    My mother is in Hell living in Tn. We were from Ct, and that's were most of her people still are. Only a few left, which gives their views validity, because they feel they are of the "heavanly Class". She only has phone contact and tape recorded talks. She does mailings of literature to people from the obituaries in the paper, just sermon stuff. She has had contact one time in Chattanooga at one of her conventions a few years ago, about 15 or 20 people attended and a speaker from the north that she used to know years ago was there, so she was happy, but since then she misses being back North.

    Well...that's it in a nut shell.

    Heaven, Thanks for your comments and advice, I really appreciate it.


  • yumbby

    This is off topic.. but what an interesting post!!! Wow! I never knew that there was still an active russelite religion and their teachings sound...well... different! Hmm! I have some research to do!

    I hope you find a way of dealing with this, I have no advice but to keep doing what your doing and vent here when you get upset!


  • CC Ryder
    CC Ryder

    Hi Yumbby, I thought you would like to visit their web site.

    thanks for all your comments everyone!


    edited to swap the web address with their home address.

    Edited by - CC Ryder on 3 February 2003 23:31:24

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