VA shooting suspect was raised a JW! He mentions it on his Twitter account (page 11)

nonjwspouse

This may have been mentioned on this super long thread, I don't know but simon:

t doesn't matter why they do what they do. The fact is that people having easy access to firearms, especially automatic weapons designed for fast uninterrupted shooting, is what too often changes what would otherwise be some unfortunate incident into a tragedy.
Whether they kill because of mental illness, terrorism, crime, self-promotion or whatever ... they simply couldn't kill so many, so quickly, without having the guns.

How many people were killed in the WTC/ Pentagon etc attacks? How many guns were involved in that?

Food for thought.

Also, the people that are so dangerous are the ones that make their view of reality one that justifies such mass killings. Religion, whether found in actual doctrine, or in warped minds of those who read doctrine in some justifiable lethal way, many times has a part in that.

Boeing Stratofortress

How many people were killed in the WTC/ Pentagon etc attacks? How many guns were involved in that?

Apples and oranges. Question is, how many WTC attacks have been sucessfully carried out SINCE September 11? None

Why?? Because the standard operating procedure (SOP) for US airlines AT THAT TIME was to COMPLY with hijacker demands, and take them wherever they wanted to go. Resisting them on our own, as we flightcrews were taught, would only make the situation worse. Instead, we would use certain code words, transponder codes, or flap configurations to signal law enforcement/SWAT that we'd need their help post-landing. 9/11 changed all that overnight. That's why similar attempts (shoe bomber, underwear bomber) never had a chance. Next time someone stands up with a box cutter on a crowded plane, they're gonna get body slammed in a heartbeat. That's especially true if you happen to have a few current/former military guys onboard.

Now, contrast that to the nutter who suddenly starts shooting up a dark, crowded theater. Well, you can tackle him if you can even FIND him, or if he doesn't mow you down first. You have a concealed carry permit? Fine, but you might want your NVGs so you can pick the bastard out.

I think one of the Aussies chimed in earlier, and perhaps they can comment on this: at one time, guns were fairly prevalent down under. But, since the Port Arthur massacre, and subsequent gun 'amnesty' program, there haven't been any similar incidents since. No mall, school, workplace massacres...nuthin.' Hmm, coincidence?? Don't think so.

Of course there might be 'thug crimes,' home break-ins, foul play, gun suicides in Oz that we don't hear much about in the Americas. Would be good to get an Aussie's view.

OneFingerSalute

@Simon. . ."We welcome facts and reasoning because both are on our side."

funniest thing I read on here all day!!

Oogie

In Ireland, where handguns are illegal, only the criminals have them. Citizens get shot by these criminals. Citizens who aren't allowed to legally own handguns to defend themselves.

Frazzled UBM

In the same way i can't understand how people believe the BS of the WBTS, I can't understand how people believe the BS of the US gun lobby. It is ideology of the worse sort and the raionalisations being put forward on this blog to justify not tightening gun control in the US are pathetic. For example:

Oogie: "In Ireland, where handguns are illegal, only the criminals have them. Citizens get shot by these criminals. Citizens who aren't allowed to legally own handguns to defend themselves."

Now Oogie - have you thought to compare murder rates between the US and Ireland? I did and it is 4.7 in the US compared to 1.2 in Ireland. It is 1.1 in Australia where strict gun controls were imposed after a mass shooting. This resutled in a sharp drop in the murder rate and eliminated mass shooting incidents. To those outside the US gun cult the answer is obvious and rational.

wozza

Ah we need a new system

Frazzled UBM

Read this all yee who still don't think gun control is a good idea

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2015/08/26/gun-control-mass-shootings_n_8043364.html

Billyblobber

Those of us that talk about things like mental health are not doing it to "make excuses" or whatever strawmen are flying around at the time.

Those are the people that see the nuance to problems on the societal level and then attempt to figure out ways to fix or alleviate those problems. When talking about mental health, it's talking about restoring the infrastructure that was removed in the 80s in America to help those with problems, and also to remove the stigma that centers around mental health so that problems that lead to things like this can be addressed before they turn into things like this, more often.

"Pointing blame" or simply labeling people as "evil" or whatever only serves to make the person who says those things feel better about life and play into just-world fallacy. It's easier to just say "some people are evil" than to think that friends/family/neighbors are just a bad day or a further shift in chemicals from doing something horrible. Thats also why people would rather focus on criminal punishment than the society that leads people to being criminals, clear black and white lines of "good" and "bad" just make the world less scary to them.

Billyblobber

Sure you can correlate emotions with mental health but is it true in every case like this? A thug, who's mad at society and mad about his life, goes out and kills some people. Is he mentally ill?

The gunman was suffering from bouts of extreme paranoia, with management and coworkers having suggested to him multiple times to get medical help, as his paranoia was to the point of apparently hallucinating or imagining things happen that weren't actually happening (see the watermelon thing quoted earlier). Dylan Root's attack on the black church combined with his firing seems to have completely set off his paranoia to the tipping point where the thought a race war was actually happening to him (see his statements), which prompted this. So, yes, it was a large issue here, as documented in the information released about the case.

LoveUniHateExams

@Billyblobber

Both Dylan Roof and this latest nutcase could have sought help. They chose not to.

Lots of people, sane or otherwise, get fired from their jobs.

Even mentally ill people must take at least some responsibility for their actions.

VA shooting suspect was raised a JW! He mentions it on his Twitter account

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