You may have heard of the terrible tradegy and loss of life to 150 Australians on the Indoneasian Island of Bali on the 12/10/2002. The media here has been doing overtime on these terrorists and the Muslim religion. We are used to seeing this sort of thing in other parts of the world, but so close to Australian shores, our prime minister Mr Howard has said we will never look at the world in such a free and carefree way again and talking to people I think he is right. Anyway after meeting with Kelpie this morning I decided to go to the Mosque and chat to anyone there who would listen. Canberra is very multicultural but finding the Mosque was a bit hard . What symble would they use on the map and what about there customs there? I remembered a Mosque in a suburb in Yarralumla. Once I got to Yarralumla I soon found the place everyone was outside and it seemed they had finished whatever they do at Mosques, Anyway I jumped the low fence and walked over to a group of dark skinned people. There were five in the group one walked off as I approached two were in ordinary clothes,one had a guards uniform on and the other was in a type of robe and a funny white hat. They all smiled and I introduced myself as I shook there hands. I started out by talking about the terrible tragedy in Bali and how these events would effect the cohesiveness of our society. My new friends all informed me they were Indonesians themselves and they didnt like what was happening in their country.Before this event these Indonesians were planning a holiday to Bali themselves. We talked about the political system in Indonesia and I asked them if they thought their government had the will to see this through and bring the fanatical Islamic fundamentalists to justice. My new friends assured me that they now beleived there government would have the will to see this thing through. Everyone was now leaving the grounds and my friends excused themselves. As we walked across to our vehicles I commented on the design of the Mosque and if they allways put an ICBM aimed at america in their grounds. 'Oh thats a mineret', Yea Im not really that ignorant, I would like to recommend that we meet with these people express our concerns and build friendship before the bullets start flying. Barry
I went to the Mosque today
Hi Barry: Good post, and your points prompted me to bring out some thoughts from your American brother.
our prime minister Mr Howard has said we will never look at the world in such a free and carefree way again and talking to people I think he is right.
When such an event happens, it does change how we see the world. Imagine this happening in Perth, Canberra, or Sydney with several high-rise buildings coming down killing thousands. (Six or seven buildings came down in New York including the Twin Towers) In this issue, Austrailians are now joining the USA in understanding that terrorism cannot be tolerated. The good news is that Indonesia and their government is taking swift and decisive action ... and this is important given that they are the world's most populous Muslim nation. Most other Muslim nations have been rather slow to react, and their reactions have been lukewarm at best.
Yea Im not really that ignorant, I would like to recommend that we meet with these people express our concerns and build friendship before the bullets start flying.
The problem is, the bullets have already started flying. The time for building was about 50 to 75 years ago. It was not done. These people, especially their radical elements are still resentful over the Crusades, for their culture does not forget as we do in western cultures ... they pass on this hatred and resentment for generation after generation.
There is ONLY ONE WAY to redeem ourselves in their eyes. KILL OURSELVES, and HAND THEM THE KEYS TO OUR HOMES BEFORE WE DIE. Once people in the west learn to understand that we will never have peace with the these people for the next one thousand years, then maybe they will begin to understand that we are at war and start to act like it.
None of us in the West like this. Some of our politicians even try to blame the USA and UK for past sins and bringing this on ourselves. But the truth is, WE of this generation had nothing to do with past sins. We all want to get along with people and live and let live. We have a strong distaste for fighting, especially over past sins. But in their culture (mostly mid-eastern and not Indonesia) they love to die for Allah. To them war and death means life. That is why they consider the current western culture to be weak and pathetic. They respect STRENGTH and POWER. That is why we must invade Iraq and a few others and show them the strength they so desperately desire. Then we will have peace.
We have already invaded Iraq twelve years ago, but we did not finish the job, and they consider this weak. Our invasion of Afghanistan is not enough ... we need to go much farther to make the point. We need to scare the shit out of the world as did the Soviet Union, and then they will leave us alone.
The Muslim religion is suppose to be about PEACE. I believe it was founded to foster peace among people and a culture that traditionally loves war. It has not totally worked for them anymore than the Christian religion of love has worked for the west. This issue is not about Islam or Christianity, but about two cultures that will be locked into war until one prevails over the other ... it will not be settled by compromise, negotiation, or peaceful deliberation. It will be settled by steel gonads, intestinal fortitude, and a lot of blood.
We need good strong leaders in all the western nations, and set the wussy-pussys aside to rule in another century.
Edited by - Amazing on 18 October 2002 10:55:11
I'm normaly impressed with your contributions here but this one I have to take exception. So few years ago the "Iron Curtain" would never come down and it would take a nuclear confrontation to resolve the complete rift between USSR and the US. Look how far we've come! I do not feel we will ever desire to or will ever try to eradicate the muslim world either through a consultative process or through armed conquest, nor will the attitude of religio-imperial domination a few of the radical muslims be successful. There will be a reconcilliation between these cultures and IMHO much of the freedoms of the west will be adopted by the moderate and liberal muslims, who will be the future of that great culture. We may very well attempt to dominate through juvenile militaristic christocentric methods, but they will only result in a temporary self satisfaction that will evaporate like a droplet of water on the hot pavement.
I have great hopes for America actually leading the world toward freedom and openness. Already many of the non-muslim contries that were ruled by despots have secumbed to the spirit of freedom. If we but practice a semblence of moral and ethical behavior in our dealings with the muslim world, it too will see its despotic governments implode. All we need to do is "stand in the right place" and not prevent it from its due course.
"Oh, East is East and West is West, and never the twain shall meet."
The death toll has now been revised down to 103 and there is declared a day of mourning sunday. Thanks my American brother Amazing I allways like to read youre posts and I have a lot of respect for what you say. I wasnt trying to belittle what happened in the states its just what happened in the states around the world and then on our own doorstep is more than most people here can fathom.
Carmel the Soviets couldnt compete with the rest of the world economically thats why they had to change and maybe we should develope other types of energy so as to ruin the mid eastern economies and bring change there too. My idear to go to the Mosque was to engage with these people in our own communities and I will continue to do this its my way of dealing with the anger I feel at the killing of so many innocent lives, and their only crime was that they were enjoying life.Barry