Are atheist's covered under the "freedom of religion banner do you think ? Does saying that atheism are not a religion threaten any would be rights therefore ? How can you protect nothingness or not having a creed ?
According to Mother Jones, 52% of Americans claim they would not vote for a well-qualified atheist as president.[80] More recently a 2007 Gallup poll produced nearly identical results.[81] A 2006 study at the University of Minnesota showed atheists to be the most distrusted minority among Americans. In the study, sociologists Penny Edgell, Joseph Gerties and Douglas Hartmann conducted a survey of American public opinion on attitudes towards different groups. 40% of respondents characterized atheists as a group that "does not at all agree with my vision of American society", putting atheists well ahead of every other group, with the next highest being Muslims (26%) and homosexuals (23%).
Discrimination against atheists http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_religion_in_the_United_States#Situation_of_atheists
Freedom OF religion, or freedom FROM religion .. what do you wish for and why ?
by caliber 9 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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caliber
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Fernando
Personally I would want freedom from religion.
From personal experience ALL religion is a snare and a racket, an irreformable enemy of God and man.
That being said, there are billions of basically good people trapped, fooled, deceived, starved and undermined by religion, to varying degrees.
Most laughable is the many missionary organisations running around the third world preaching the gospel, when they have no idea what the gospel is. Imagine a would be car salesman who has no idea that a Ford is a motorcar! Just ask any "Christian" to explain what the gospel is in one word, and prepare to be gobsmacked. This is the diabolical work of religion.
(Why does the "true religion" secretly blind its followers to the "Good News" according to Paul, Moses, Isaiah and Psalms?)
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TotallyADD
Caliber. Freedom from religion would be great. Joe the drunk had it right were he said religion is a snare and a racket. Atheists are being demonized by fundamentalist churches just the same way WT did with all other reglions. I have read fundamentalist literature and it is full of lies, racism, hatred and cherry pick thinking about atheists I thought I was reading a WT. To me freedom of religion is a big threat to all our freedoms in the U.S. If I went of TV and said half of what these fundamentalist churches say about ones they don't like. I would be throw in jail and key throw away. Totally ADD
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caliber
If I went of TV and said half of what these fundamentalist churches say about ones they don't like. I would be throw in jail and key throw away. Totally ADD
Please give me a sample or example of hateful things...
also is there not a difference cult religion and religion ?
A group is called a cult because of their behaviour - not their doctrines. Doctrine is an issue in the area of Apologetics and Heresy. Most religious cults do teach what the Christian church would declare to be heresy but some do not. Some cults teach the basics of the Christian faith but have behavioural patterns that are abusive, controlling
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Band on the Run
We have clear boundaries and enforcement for freedom of religion. What we lack and most other Western democracies have is freedom from religion. They are not opposites. Both can exist. In fact, countries around the world use our Const'n as a template to write their const'ns. Not having freedom from religion made sense in 1789. Not having an established church was a major step in civilization.
It is no longer 1789. Many countries with values similar to our own already have freedom from religion. I am missing some French accent marks but the French concept is called laicite. Europe was so abused by the Roman Catholic Church long after England and other Northern European countries went Protestant. The French Revolution swept religion away from government. Americans were special in 1789. Now we seriously lag behind in fundamental rights. We don't even have to experiment to determine what to do. Our economic and cultural allies already have practiced the concept. We would be joining them, not starting something new.
I don't know the reasons for atheism. To me, it is a religion in legal terms. It needs protection. If the poll is true, there is bigotry. Of course, bigotry is nothing new for Americans. Most people don't read papers. TV does not have time to discuss this situation. I only know how grave the threat is b/c I decided this area was so complex that it would highlight certain skills. In the name of freedom of religion, (fundamentalists and Roman Catholicism in most of the cases), Americans are losing freedom of religion. Freedom from religion would merely allow people to stop paying taxes to fund Notre Dame students to teach in parochial schools. It was the American ideal that Americans would never be forced to pay taxes for religion. It is not a threat in the future. The assault on freedom has happened. It continues to happen.
When I started my research, George W. Bush was reviled for funding social welfare programs that were faith=based. His general stupidity and fundamentalism were too much for even conservatives. People would talk about how Bush should be impeached. Well, appoint only Catholics to the Court and certain consequences fall. I should say right wing Catholics. Well, sooner or later the Democrats would return to power and this travesty will end. Well, one of Obama;s first and continuing acts was to enlarge the funding of faith-based programs. A group of churches and others, went to the Supreme Court to stop the funding. Clearly, Congress could never fund such a program. The funds are not appropriated in the normal manner. The money comes from discretionary executive administrative budgets. Only, Congress does fund these accounts.
James Madison wrote his Remonstrance against taxes for religion before the War. The VA legislature and then the federal const'n drafters and ratifies argued that it was fundamentally unfair to tax a man (only white men with huge amounts of real property could vote) to support any religion not his choice.
Altho Obama studied at Harvard Law and taught Const'l Law himself at Univ. of Chicago, he can't see that tax dollars paid by individuals fund the discretinary budgets. All the brain power and insight, compared to George W. (stupid) Bush and we have less freedom of religion than ever. I say to read Dred Scott, the decision that upheld slavery, and hastened the Civil War.
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caliber
I don't know the reasons for atheism. To me, it is a religion in legal terms.
To obtain their rights & freedoms I see no other approach.. but how do you circumvent this ...
re·li·gion
/ r?'l?d?
?n / Show Spelled [ ri- lij - uh n ] Show IPA noun 1. a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature , and purpose of the universe, especially when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs. 2. a specificfundamental set of beliefs and practices generally agreed upon by a number of persons or sects: the Christianreligion; the Buddhist religion. 3. the body of personsadhering to a particular set of beliefs and practices: a world council of religions. 4. the practice of religious beliefs;ritual observance of faith Can atheism be just the absence of belief... there must be some driving force or motivation -
Max Divergent
As BOTR says, this is one of the big points that makes the US materially different to the other western democracies. And it does no credit to the US. Americans and America have done some of the most amazing and meritorious things in human history: but on this point there seems a collective refusal to be rational*, at least on this point and maybe on others, that makes one wonder how Americans have functioned as a nation, let alone acheive what they have achieved.
But I wonder if the trouble they are having now (economy, debt, poverty, corporate excess, social division on "right" / "left" terms, healthcare access /affordability etc) are just different manifestations of the same thinking styles that allows such a big and prominant part of the nation to live by an extreme reliance on the existance of God.
People can beleive in God, and yet act and speak rationally. But too many Americans (and an increasing minority following American-style religions outside the US) just don't. Some talk like madmen and twist facts and reason to accomodate God.
Please, this is neither anti-American nor anti-God comment. It is wonderment that a country as advanced and as well endowned in the best of educational facilities (eg: any school in the so-called Ivy Leauge), the most inventive of people (insert list of grand 'only in America' achievements) and the best of thinkers (insert long list) can have this ugly flip side of bigotry and ignorance and credulity.
* I think it takes a heap of rationality to make a success of a big, complex and powerful nation; there may be other ways to either succeed or measure success that don't rely on rationalism at the core. If there are, I don't know of them.
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Tater-T
You can't have freedom of religion ..... without freedom from religion....................................
look it UP!
It's that simple.....
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caliber
Religious liberty might be supposed to mean that everybody is free to discuss religion. In practice it means that hardly anybody is allowed to mention it.”
? G.K. ChestertonBirds without trees can never feel free.
?n / Show Spelled [ ri- lij - uh