memorial talk - what scripture was cited to validate new claim to stop observing ? Is Manuscript available?
by dreamgolfer 9 Replies latest jw friends
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BlindersOff1
New Memorial outline for download
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Splash
At our memorial, this was read:
(1Co 11:23-26) "For I received from the Lord that which I also handed on to YOU, that the Lord Jesus in the night in which he was going to be handed over took a loaf 24 and, after giving thanks, he broke it and said: “This means my body which is in YOUR behalf. Keep doing this in remembrance of me.” 25 He did likewise respecting the cup also, after he had the evening meal, saying: “This cup means the new covenant by virtue of my blood. Keep doing this, as often as YOU drink it, in remembrance of me.” 26 For as often as YOU eat this loaf and drink this cup, YOU keep proclaiming the death of the Lord, until he arrives."
The point was made that this statement was made by Paul to the anointed.
However, read who Paul was actually speaking to in his letter introduction:
(1Co 1:1, 2) "Paul, called to be an apostle of Jesus Christ through God’s will, and Sos′the·nes our brother 2 to the congregation of God that is in Corinth, to YOU who have been sanctified in union with Christ Jesus, called to be holy ones, together with all who everywhere are calling upon the name of our Lord, Jesus Christ, their Lord and ours:"
Paul addresses his letter to both the anointed and the non-anointed in the Corinthian congregation.
This informs us that the Greek Scriptures were not just for the anointed, and also that non-anointed were present and partaking of the emblems during the first century.
Splash.
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Phizzy
No it doesn't. All had the hope of living in heaven eventually. No "non anointed" existed within the christian groups, all were born again if Chrisitians.
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blondie
*** w10 3/15 p. 27 par. 16 One Flock, One Shepherd ***
Paul also helps us to understand that those with an earthly hope do not partake of the Memorial emblems. He said to anointed Christians: “For as often as you eat this loaf and drink this cup, you keep proclaiming the death of the Lord, until he arrives.” (1 Cor. 11:26) When does the Lord ‘arrive’? When he comes to take the last of his anointed bride class to their heavenly home. (John 14:2, 3) Clearly, the annual observance of the Lord’s Evening Meal is not to continue endlessly. “The remaining ones” of the woman’s seed yet on earth will continue to partake of this meal until all of them have received their heavenly reward. (Rev. 12:17)
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Thus their reasoning is that when the last of the 144,000 die and go to heaven, the memorial ends.
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Phizzy
That isn't actually "reasoning" is it Blondie ? They start with a premise that Paul believes as they do, in two hopes, one Earthly one Heavenly, what is their proof that Paul taught that ?
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Splash
@Phizzy No "non anointed" existed within the christian groups, all were born again if Chrisitians.
So who was Paul referring to when he wrote his letter to the "holy ones, together with all who everywhere are calling upon the name of our Lord" in the Corinthian congregation?
Or "to all the holy ones in union with Christ Jesus who are in Phi·lip′pi, along with overseers and ministerial servants"?
What about the 100,000's of thousands of Christians who gave their lives in the arenas and persecutions of the first century - certainly more than 144,000 of them?
All of those persecuted and murdered Christians would have celebrated and partook of the emblems, so non-anointed were partakers.
The alternative is that there were less than 144,000 Christians in the early part of Christianity, which is nonsense. In fact it is far less than 144,000 because many 10,000's have partaken since the 1900's.
If JW's have gone from 18,000 at the memorial in 1914 to 186,000 just thirty years later, how quickly would the first century Christians have increased with miracles being performed in front of them?
What you suggest is that God did not have a choice as to who was anointed. If you were born into Christianity because of your parents, you were automatically anointed?
Splash.
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Bobcat
The Corinthians Christians "were called to be holy ones" - "together with all who everywhere are calling upon the name of our Lord . . ."
All Christians, "everywhere," were "called to be holy ones."
The phrase reminds the Corinthians that they were part of a much larger association than just in Corinth.
The phrase "holy ones" has several implications, including conduct and lifestyle, as well as being part of the people of God. The phrase has OT roots referring to God's people who 'had to be holy because I, Jehovah, am holy.' (Lev 19:1, 2) But behind being "holy ones" in the NT, or Christian sense, is the idea of having been 'born of the spirit' to a new life. And just as the Mosaic Law framed the association of God's people prior to Jesus, the New Covenant forms the framework for defining the people of God, the "holy ones" since Jesus.
Take Care
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pearl doxsey
They do this to hold on to 1914, and the power that doctrine gives them (They are the faithful slave, appointed by the returned Christ). They likely base it upon 1Cor.11:26, that states that we hold the Memorial until the arrival of Christ. Online writings exposed the unreasonableness of Claiming Christ arrived 100 years ago, and yet the Memorial continues to be observed.
First, it was "stop counting partakers"...then it was "there is no faithful slaves except the GB"....Now it is, there's no faithful slave at all.
WHY? This all fulfills prophecy. Dan.12:7 reads: "...when the power of the Holy Ones has been completely shattered; all these things shall be finished." It's time to rid the Beast of the Harlot who rides it. Every detail in Revelation is in plain sight, but it needs to be seen spiritually. (Rev.11:1,2; Matt.24:15).
So when people here were wondering why there were two groups of people on the Memorial invitation, the upper group are all dead now. They are now referred to as the 144000. Only problem for the WT now is....
Jesus said that the anointed generation would "by no means pass away" until ALL things occur.....including the new world...where the dead are resurrected and all maladies are healed and we live forever.
I wonder what the next BS will be.
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Phizzy
Paul knew nothing of any 144,000. Revelation wasn't written till way after his death. His greetings at the beginning and/or end of his letters are inclusive, they are not to seperate groups with a different hope, where does he say this ?
Yes they all would have partaken of the bread and wine, because all were followers of Jesus, all had become His children, none were excluded, " neither slave nor freeman jew or gentile male or female", all were one in the Lord.
All first century christians were "born again", anointed with Holy Spirit. There was no group excluded from the Spirit, only non-believers.
One is not born again until baptism, being born in to a christian family is just that, it doesn't make you a christian.