Gentile Times ? When ?

by *lost* 9 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • *lost*
    *lost*

    If Christians are the gentiles ...

    ............many nations of man. God's earthly children shepherded by Gods Heavenly Kingdom. through Jesus the Son Via the Bible inspired to men by the Power of holy spirit, to become workers/slaves of God on earth to do the sowing/planting, growing on the crop ready for the master to harvest / see the produce of the great work effort ? of all of the workers on earth .....the earthly children of God. Being cared for/shepherded by, the faithful earthly sons of God on earth ( the TRUE faithful and discreet slave ). As forewarned about by Jesus, by the message he has given us, and spiritual helpers in men...........

    Then are we still possibly living in the Gentile Times ?

    Going right up until the end of the sytem of things?

    The great harvest ?

    By Jesus as foretold to us ?

    And handed down through the generations of mankind throughout history to preserve alive the Word of God ?

    The message ? though pure and true maybe got a little dirty along the way and left away to oneside and neglected at times ?

    Until someone, tutor, great one, comes along and rediscovers it and brings it back into our memories ?

    Like a good book, we read over a few times in our lives, or study ? like a manual ? We refer back to it a lot because there is where we find our stories, our history, our warnings, examples, life stories, justice, laws,, morals.... etc. ?

    Then we have to dig deep into these subjects and analyse them and study them and try to understand their true meanings and origins so that we can come to an accurate ''truth'' of all things ?

    So we dig deep into the scriptures and research, study etc. and we dig deep into our history and artifacts the evidence to try to get a greater understanding of things from that was left behind by our ancestors. Forefathers ? their records, memories ?

    It's done in other areas of life. Cattle Breeding (types, strains, breeds, traits) is an example. Dog breeding.

    A type/kind but of the same 'species'. Origins of the species ?

    It's all a pattern/system and everything is connected.

    Isn't this the entire theme of the Bible - Christianity ? brought forth through Jesus ?

    This is my understanding of it. I have much work and study to do. I know, as I have to research as much of the facts/evidence as I can to learn more and understand more. I've only just begun. The only way for me is by breaking all down to basics and trying to build up the true picture.

    I want to be dead certain of all the info facts and evidence before I make a major decision like this in my life. Which Belief/religion is. i don't think there is anything as possible as being 'born into' Christianity cos your parents were Christians. It is something you have to earn personally by your faith, works, deeds as a person as yo live your every life. regardless of your actual technical belief system your brought up in. You always strive to do your best to the best of YOUR ability, no one elses. To earn that right for a huge payoff/reward in the end, when YOUR work is complete.

    People can be used by God in different ways to accomplish HIS purpose. so we have to learn his purpose. How can we do that. we have to work at it. Study hard, research. Apply ourselves. Our thinking abilities.

    This is what I understand the true meaning of christianity to be.

    If this is true, then this argument alone is fact enough that the WT org has got something hugely wrong with it. It doesn't do what it says on the can.

    So if the master workers have become corrupted or whatever has gone wrong - what happens in every business when the owner finds out the staff are robbing him blind ? He gets rid of them.

    So if jw are asking questins and starting to wake up to whats happening anad are now roaming about in his word to try to find out what to do, now something has gone wrong, they refer back to the manuel to find out how to fix it. This can only be a good thing - because it is the word of god through Jesus who is telling us. NOT MAN.

    Obey God before man, but pay back ceasars things to ceaser. If man is trying to lead you away from the Christ and God, you don't follow. you follow after Jesus. (do not allow yourself to be separated from God's love and protection ) Do not follow after a man... watch out for the snares of the devil.

    If GB are men - not guided by God's spirit, then they are not to be obeyed or followed - as commanded by Jesus. Which they cannot argue against or disprove, as the Bible will prove them wrong.

    Like they are on Spiritual Trial now - being scrutinised. the auditors are in, so to speak. Whistleblowers are having a field day. It has been know to happen in corporations, organisations, public sectors, governments, churches, society... etc.

    If this is the truth of Christianity. ?

    please forgive me the rants..... i have been up all night and i have never felt as interested and energised about something in such a long time, I'm rather excited about everything I am learnig, thinking etc. I'd like to hope a can have a little bit of happiness out of the, well. poo. lol. I needed to get it out of my head so i can start putting things into perspective and find out whats gone wrong.

    thank you for being kind and patient and for any comments whatsoever you could please make as it will help me so much to figure it all out.

    kind regards

    lost

  • Brother of the Hawk
    Brother of the Hawk

    Hi Lost. You might find the book 'The Gentile Times Reconsidered' by Carl Olaf Jonsson. He was a JW for decades. But he make some really good points in there. If you read the scriptures about the 'Gentile' governments, it's God that brings these Governments to their end/destruction, that is when the gentile times will end. I know that WT philosphy will claim that the gentile times ended in 1914, but you cannot take a physical prophecy regarding the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 c.e and turn it into a SPIRITUAL application.

    History has shown us that in 1948 the United Nations gave the right to natural Jews to reoccupy Israel. They're being allowed to reoccupy Jerusalem was granted in 1967. But to this day the Arabs control the temple mount, so in a Physical application because the Arabs control the temple mount, it can still be claimed that Jerusalem is still being 'trampled on' by the gentile nations.

    Hope this helps

    Affectionately

    Brother of the Hawk

  • Pterist
    Pterist

    Hi "Lost"

    Here is one view with emphasis on the "gentile times" being the time for the good news being available to the gentile world following the "first right of refusal" offered to fleshly Israel "Jews".

    http://www.padfield.com/acrobat/history/days-of-vengeance.pdf

    Shalom

  • Pterist
    Pterist

    Here is a link to COJ's latest (I think) edition of "The Gentile Times Reconsidered"

    http://kristenfrihet.se/english/gtr4/contents.htm

  • Pterist
    Pterist

    hi Lost again,

    You might be interested in end time eschatology from a Partial Preterism perspective as I was when I left the org., because of the WBTS flawed premillennium "type" eschatology.

    "The Days of Vengeance" by David Chilton.....( NOT the same as the one I posted above).

    http://www.preteristarchive.com/Books/pdf/1987_chilton_days-of-vengeance.pdf Copy and paste into your browser..... This forum's software is not fully functional on my iPad so I can't make the links clickable, sorry Shalom

  • *lost*
    *lost*

    Thanks everyonCould it all boil down to one simple thing. lik.

    God is rea, Satan is real, Everything we have learned about God, Jesus, the Bible, are real and true.

    If god is saying, i am god, this is how it all went wrong, these are the reasong, the history. I sent Jesus to try to put things right, to remind you I am still here. It's still true, i am going to sort this out in the end.

    When we come to the 'time of the end' actually, when we reach 'the end' of this system of things. Jesus will return and the whole world will then know I AM GOD. Now I will do all that I said I will do.

    That is when he personally through Jesus will re-set the whole thing, then put it back to how he originally intended it to be.

    and all the other stuff is just irrelevant, dates, phrophecies .. things not to be focused on. Just live life everyday being a good person living a good life, believing that when the time is right, one day, it will happen.

    Is ignorance acceptable? Is not believing anything about any of it acceptable. Are we being told the answer. Spiritually, as individuals. Not in relation to any organisation of religion in any shape or form.

    Do people who leave stop bellieving in anything at all ?

    Or they keep pondering these things, and keep seeking. ?

    Does anyone else think like this and ponder on things. The why's, what's etc.

    thanks, lost

  • Black Sheep
    Black Sheep

    I didn't come right until I admitted that everything I thought I knew about God had been supplied by the cult that I'd had the misfortune to be born into.

  • Rattigan350
    Rattigan350

    Gentile Times Reconsidered? Are you serious. He needs to reconsider it.

    1 Samuel 7

    I shall certainly raise up your seed after you, which will come out of your inward parts; and I shall indeed firmly establish his kingdom. 13 He is the one that will build a house for my name, and I shall certainly establish the throne of his kingdom firmly to time indefinite. 14 I myself shall become his father, and he himself will become my son. When he does wrong, I will also reprove him with the rod of men and with the strokes of the sons of Adam. 15 As for my loving-kindness, it will not depart from him the way I removed it from Saul, whom I removed on account of you. 16 And your house and your kingdom will certainly be steadfast to time indefinite before you; your very throne will become one firmly established to time indefinite.”’”

    That is a prophesy leading to Christ, starting with Solomon, his descendants were sitting on Jehovah's throne, and one day Jesus would be sitting on Jehovah's throne. But from David, time went by and Jesus never sat on a throne. Infact Jehoiakim became a vassal king subject to Egypt and Babylon and the the kingdom fully fell. It appears that the throne was not firmly established. It seemed as if that prophesy failed; or did it?

    No, it didnt' fail, Jehovah just paused it for 7 times or 2520 years and then Jesus was installed as king, not in old Jerusalem which was rejected, but in new Jerusalem which is heavenly.

  • Pterist
    Pterist

    **** No, it didnt' fail, Jehovah just paused it for 7 times or 2520 years and then Jesus was installed as king, not in old Jerusalem which was rejected, but in new Jerusalem which is heavenly. ****

    7 times 2520 is pure speculation and conjecture.... Daniel's world powers ended with the Roman empire, it was then that Satan was defeated, sin and death were conquered in the person of the incarnate WORD of Yahweh. 1 John the eternal life in flesh, 1 John 5:9-13 available now.

    Colossians 1:13.... The early church were already transferred into that kingdom.

    Matthew 28:18 ....ALL authority has been given Jesus already in Heaven and Earth.

    We are now awaiting the New Heavens and New Earth for their completion. 2 Peter 3:

    10 But the day of the Lord will come like a thief. The heavens will disappear with a roar; the elements will be destroyed by fire, and the earth and everything done in it will be laid bare. [a]

    11 Since everything will be destroyed in this way, what kind of people ought you to be? You ought to live holy and godly lives 12 as you look forward to the day of God and speed its coming. [b] That day will bring about the destruction of the heavens by fire, and the elements will melt in the heat. 13 But in keeping with his promise we are looking forward to a new heaven and a new earth, where righteousness dwells.

    14 So then, dear friends, since you are looking forward to this, make every effort to be found spotless, blameless and at peace with him. 15 Bear in mind that our Lord’s patiencemeans salvation, just as our dear brother Paul also wrote you with the wisdom that God gave him. 16 He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction.

    17 Therefore, dear friends, since you have been forewarned, be on your guard so that you may not be carried away by the error of the lawless and fall from your secure position. 18 But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and forever! Amen.

    No one knows the day or hour , 2520 ...607-1914 is false prophesy that Jesus warned us about ........Matthew 24:26 ... Here he is, in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it. 27 For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man?

    Inner room = secret, invisible to most !!!!

    Shalom

  • Brother of the Hawk
    Brother of the Hawk

    Lost: Without getting into a debate about the Gentile Times, to answer your question. Since my wife & I were in the WTBT$ for 40+ years, we when we came out, we still believe in God, Jesus & the bible but we've had to re-examine religious dogma, beliefs and re-invent ourselves as Chritians. If you have not already done so, re-read the account at Acts 15: 1-23. There are actually 2 absolute laws and 2 conscience matters. To find the conscience matters go to 1 Cor 8: 1-12. Then ask yuorself, if this was a decision made by a so-called 1 st century governing body then why does Paul contradict and go against their decision?

    This is what we have elected not to do, continue to research from literature that is producing the lie, namely WTBT$. That would be like going to Satan and asking him for advice and expecting to get truth, it cannot be done. There are several resources available on line, outside of WTBT$.

    If you haven't read Ramond Franz's books yet, we highly recommend it.

    As regarding your post to my 607 conundrum I posted the page from the Interpreter's bible dictionary; regarding Ezekiel he did not even receive his commission as prophet until the year 598. We also watched a documentary that verified this, that is where we noticed the discrepancy that the WTBT$ was wrong about their 607 bce date. It was from the History Channel and called 'The Prophets'. So, it is pointless for God to commission Ezekiel 9 years after Jerusalem was destroyed. That would be like putting a condom on after you've already had sex. Pointless.

    Affectionately

    Brother of the Hawk

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit