Armageddon and the Second Coming

by Cold Steel 7 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Cold Steel
    Cold Steel

    Can anyone explain the Jehovah's Witness eschatology surrounding Armageddon and the Second Coming of Christ? I realize the church teaches that Jesus came "invisibly" in 1914 and is ruling from Heaven, but if He is ruling, why does evil still exist? If Satan and his angels were cast out of Heaven to Earth, how was man tempted before 1914? And how did Christ cast them out of people? Did the evil spirits simply travel between Heaven and Earth?

    Armageddon is also a question mark with me. According to the scriptures, Armageddon comes just before the Millennium, but it happens in Jerusalem and only concerns Judah and the Beast. The JW concept resembles Ragnarök, the last great battle, one of good versus evil. But in the Poetic Edda, the battle ends with the destruction of both. The scriptures indicate that Armageddon ends with Jesus (Jehovah) coming to the Mount of Olives and save the unconverted Jews. They explain it thus:

    And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south. And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee. (Zechariah 14)

    Note that this refers to the coming of "the Lord my God," which is Christ. John wrote: “Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him.” (Revelation 1:7) After the coming of Jehovah, Zechariah writes: “In that day shall there be a great mourning in Jerusalem, as the mourning of Hadadrimmon in the valley of Megiddon.” So Jehovah comes, saves and converts the Jews, and then there is mourning because the Jews realized their fathers had killed the Messiah.

    What does this mean?

    • Jesus and Jehovah are one and the same
    • He comes to Jerusalem and descends upon the Mount of Olives, which fulfills the words of the angel: " Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet...." (Acts 1:4-5)
    • Every eye shall see Him, including those in the spirit world who "pierced" Him
    • He will come with all the saints (members of the church), who will be caught up to meet Him

    To me, this is all obvious, with little room for misunderstanding. Yet the JWs are insistent that this is all wrong, and though it's carefully described in the Bible, and in some detail as shown above, and it's as if it were lifted from their scriptures and thrown in the trash can.

    I'm not trying to trash JWs, but I'm sure the Governing Body has read and knows about these scriptures. How do they rationalize Armageddon being a local event that excludes the Jews? And why would John spell out the divisions in the 144,000 in the tribes of Israel if it was just a "spiritual" interpretation. I'm baffled by their interpretation, but that's another issue.

    If you're a Jehovah's Witness and don't wish to respond here, please send me a PM. Also, do the JWs usually study prophecy, or do they just read articles about it? I'm not trying to be sarcastic, but the JWs I knew back in the 70s seemed to be much more knowledgable about the scriptures than today's members.

  • Cold Steel
    Cold Steel

    No comments here on Armageddon? To Jehovah's Witnessses, Armageddon is at the very heart of their theology. It's something they should know about and be able to defend. Yet there are no responses to these questions on these all-important events of Armageddon and the Second Coming. It really must be an issue of members learning these things through internal outlets other than the scriptures.

    The Watchtower, in April 1972, made this statement:

    So, does Jehovah have a prophet to help them, to warn them of dangers and to declare things to come?...These questions can be answered in the affirmative. Who is this prophet?...This “prophet” was not one man, but was a body of men and women. It was the small group of footstep followers of Jesus Christ, known at that time as International Bible Students. Today they are known as Jehovah’s Christian witnesses....Of course it is easy to say that this group acts as a “prophet” of God. It is another thing to prove it. The only way that this can be done is to review the record.

    We all pretty much know what a review of the record would reveal, but I can scarcely believe an entire religion would depend on an internal publication in lieu of actual scripture. Interesting.

  • wasblind

    Can anyone explain the Jehovah's Witness eschatology surrounding Armageddon and the Second Coming of Christ? I realize the church teaches that Jesus came "invisibly" in 1914 and is ruling from Heaven, but if He is ruling, why does evil still exist?_____Cold Steel

    Bottom line : Jehovah's witnesses have no idea when Jesus will come, If he came, or is he still comin'

    when they claim he would.

  • tornapart

    They believe he set up his kingdom invisibly in heaven in 1914 and at the same time threw Satan the Devil out of heaven to the earth together with his wicked angels. This is supposed to explain all the terrible troubles since 1914. They are still waiting for him to come and bring about Armageddon. Before this happens all 'false' religions are to be destroyed by the United Nations. Then Jesus will come with his angels and destroy the kings of the earth along with the rest of humanity ...except JWs of course (called the Great Crowd) who will survive to become the nucleus of the 'New System' and inherit a paradsie earth. They will be ruled over by 144,000 as kings/priests together with Jesus for 1,000 years. During this time there will be a resurrection of everyone else who has ever died.

  • Finkelstein

    In simplistic terms the WTS. doctrnes were mostly created to atract attemsion from the public in supporting the

    proliferation of theri own published litatture, a;lso as a means to cunvent their own sembelance of power and control.

    Thats why upon analising their set doctrines, particucaualyl pretaining to the return of Christ and The End Times , there is litlle

    in the bible to support them. The Watchtower is a religious publishing house with commercialism entwined its its expressed doctrines

    in variably that is " The Truth "

  • Cold Steel
    Cold Steel

    Yes, but don't they know their own eschatology?

    I get the awful feeling that they don't read the Bible, but instead rely on articles in the Watchtower. And though I don't read all the Watchtowers, I've never seen an article that references the scriptures having to do with Armageddon as an event. Like many happenings, Armageddon is foretold in great detail by ancient apostles and prophets as referenced above. They state:

    • Who will launch the war
    • What nations will make up his coalition
    • Where it will take place
    • How many troops the "Beast" (also known as "Gog" and "the Antichrist") will command
    • What he will be thinking
    • How he will be stopped by the Lord and subsequently destroyed
    • How many of his troops will be spared, and
    • How long it will take the Jews and surrounding communities to bury the dead and destroy the weapons left after the battle

    Based on these scriptural points, which are all based in prophecy, the JW interpretation of this event is simply non sequitur. The question is, who screwed the proverbial pooch? Are the JW leaders ignorant of the biblical prophecies surrounding Armageddon, or do they know about those prophecies and deliberately bugger them to their self-serving ends? If it's the former, it shows a tremendous lack of basic understanding; and if it's the latter, it shows a blatant attempt to deceive on their parts. I don't know which would be worse, but either way it screams that the foundation of the church is either gross ignorance or deception.

  • Bobcat

    Cold Steel:

    I've never seen an article that references the scriptures having to do with Armageddon as an event.

    Revelation 16:16 says "Armageddon" is a "place" (Greek topos, from which we get topography).

    Even so, I always get dumbfounded looks from JWs when I point that out to them. I think the media has alot to do with the idea that it is an event.

  • Cold Steel
    Cold Steel

    Armegeddon is both a place and an event. Every foreign power from the north has had to go through the valley of Armageddon to get to Jerusalem.

    The Jews have expected a messiah who was a deliverer. They rejected Christ because they expected a military leader or king. The Jewish leaders, according to the apostles, knew Jesus was the Messiah, but they feared Rome and were disgusted by a heavenly kingdom. So they delivered him to the Romans and he was crucified.

    In the last days the Jews would be gathered back to their lands of inheritance. And when the Antichrist came from the north, they would use the valley of Armageddon as a launching site. And according to scripture, Jesus will appear to both save and convert the Jews in the latter days.

    But the Jehovah's Witness Governing Board has rewritten the entire prophecy. And because the rank and file members don't read the Bible, but articles in JW publications, they end up not knowning prophecy.

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