Preventing a minor child from being baptized if you are their parent

by RayPublisher 44 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  Nathan Natas

  Without going to my old NWT to check, I suspect the two stories about the swine differ a bit.

  Pigs were unclean - non-kosher - and probably wouldn't have been owned by a Jew.

  Jesus destroyed another person's property as a "demon"stration of his mad skilz as a wizard.

  If your kids are gently introduced to some of the MANY inconsistencies of "God's Word," they may be less willing to give their lives and their fates to an organization that sings "these words faithful are and true" (or however that old theocratic song went).

  I think BlackSheep is giving you a "black ops" or stealth method of getting you kids to experience a bit of cognitive dissonance of their own, which will result in them saying, "hey, wait a minute..." even if they don't say it out loud.

  Apparently, for example, the Israelites did not know the value of pi - one of the most universal ratios found in the physical world.

  You might even pursue "the secret of the swine" through the Watchtower CDROM to see what illumination it provides on this subject.

  Also, on FREEMINDS you can find Ten Essays on Christianity by Tony Wills as a free download here: http://www.freeminds.org/category/2-short-articles.html
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  Black Sheep

  I think I see the problem.

  Are you only trying to keep them from joining one particular sect?

  When I realised that the WT was a scam, it took me a while to wake up that everything I thought I knew had come as an accident of birth. If Dad had been a radical Muslim, or an Orange or Green Irishman, he would have been wanting me to blow up buses in the name of his god. I couldn't trust any 'knowledge' from my past. Even the choice of holy book was only mine because because of where and when I was born. I was a spiritual babe. I knew nothing about god/s that wasn't suspect. I had to start again.

  I bought myself a few different Bibles and started reading the gospels in the chronological order in which they were written, using nothing but common sense, a Strongs Concordance and my grasp of grammar to help me.

  The two events I referred to are among the things that prevented me from getting baptised as a youth, but I never really analysed them until adulthood. I just pushed them aside as 'difficult'. Not convinced enough to get baptised, but still under mind control. How I wish I had asked myself, "Why would the demons ask for the pigs, but then drown them? Does it make more sense than borrowing Dad's car and driving it straight into the creek?"

  Is that any clearer?

  Chris
• 

  Black Sheep

  I think BlackSheep is giving you a "black ops" or stealth method of getting you kids to experience a bit of cognitive dissonance of their own, which will result in them saying, "hey, wait a minute..." even if they don't say it out loud.

  Exactly, Nathan
• 

  diamondiiz

  9 and 11 are very young kids, and at this age are still very dependent on parent's views. Try putting some fear of baptism into them, how important the step is and if they mess up they can get df and lose contact with friends, and even family members - you can use July 15 watchtower how JWs are encouraged to shun even family members. Maybe even you parents would have to treat them differently if they were df. Show that many young ones get baptized too young and many make simple and natural mistakes but get disfellowshiped for it. Show that young people don't have the experience of an adult and foolishly make mistakes where they get df and suffer by being treated like outcasts - some even commit suicide because they get so depressed. BUT non-baptized kids don't get punished for making childish mistakes. Play a concerned dub, and make them realize that getting baptized too young is a bad idea that might hurt them even though at present they think they are 100% sure they wouldn't make a mistakes many others did - where you can point out that many other youths prior to baptism also thought they would never make a such grave mistakes in the first place, after all that's why they got baptized.

  People are different and you know your kids best, use your fatherly authority to guide them in a direction that they will in time see is a great advice from a loving dad. Revealing that you don't believe in WTS would be a mistake if your wife is headstrong and hard to deal with. If you live in a country where the father has the greater rights when it comes to gaining the custody of the kids, you can go ahead an announce your beliefs now, otherwise you have to play by wts' ever changing book and get your kids out quietly with the least amount of headache from the mrs. All the best.
• 

  pbrow

  Ray,

  I am divorced from my childrens JW mother. So I realize we are in different places. I am not saying that you need to go full on apostate. Certainly go slow with the big days like christmas and easter if you feel you need to. I am talking at least about sports, school related activities and other non religious days. You would not believe the power that comes from your kids minds being opened while participating in these activities. They see these "worldy" kids in a different light when they get to participate in sports. These "worldy" kids are normal! We even had an end of the world party for campings prediction with cake and signs and a bonfire. We used it as time to tell kids about the facts, that dubs have predicted the same and how crazy it is for anyone to make those predictions. The more you DO to show them that the dubs are effed up, the more it will sink in.

  I am under the impression that you can celebrate birthdays and not get df'd. You can tell your kids that birthdays are not about peoples heads getting cut off and making yourself more important than god, but actually allowing them to have a birthday party SHOWS them that the jdub reasons are full of shit! In my mind, I can think of few things that are more important than my kids NOT becoming jw's. Whether or not someone labels me as apostate is certainly not more important than that. Again, I am not with my childrens mother so it is different, but dont you have a say in them being able to participate in things? Will it raise some eyebrows? Of course it will but what is the ultimate goal? Take your lumps for going out of the "norm" but Im telling you bro, it will work wonders for the end goal of getting those kids the fukc out of this group!

  My oldest just said the other day "I dont care what anyone says, I am always going to celebrate christmas and my birthday" She would not be able to say that if I had just limped out and played it safe not trying to ruffle any feathers. She also says "bless you" after someone sneezes without a second thought (only an exwitness knows what im talking about here)

  Good luck, there are a lot of good suggestions here. You will do the best for you and your family.

  pbrow