First Post and Using the memorial to wake up family members (page 2)

dgeero

When talking with my mother the other day I really didn't want to get into the heaven or earth hopes I wanted to purely focus on where the scriptures state partaking is limited to a specific group of Christians. Even if I were to agree the scriptures teach a paradise earth which I don't believe they do, nothing should prevent a christian from partaking regardless of their hope. When Jesus said "unless you do this you won't have everlasting life" wouldn't that equally apply to everlasting heavenly or earthly life even in their own doctrine? I don't see anywhere the scriptures differentiate or limit partaking. Then again the scriptures also don't teach two class christianity, like a lot of witness doctrine they are connecting dots that aren't there.

One of the funniest bits was when my mom said there are actually two covenants Jesus instituted in Luke, the New Covenant and the Kingdom covenant which in all my years as a dub I honestly don't remember hearing. So I ask if the Kingdom covenant applies to the 144000 wouldn't that mean the new covenant applies to all true Christians. She says not they both apply only to 144000 but other Christians can take advantage of the New covenant benefits. First of all WHAT?! How does that make any sense. Why would their be 2 separate covenants that both only apply to the same group of people that essentially serve the same purpose, to go to heaven and rule? Second how can you benefit from a covenant or arrangement you aren't a part of? Makes no sense. But I guess that's what you get for trying to apply logic and reason to a book written thousands of years ago by superstitious people.

I agree but lately I've noticed a lot of witnesses acting like the memorial is somewhat of a burden. My coworker is a witness. He asked me today(not knowing I'm inactive) what time my memorial was. He then said he was glad they had one after theirs so they could hurry up and get out of the hall quick. I laughed inside because I can't imagine some other christian group in a hurry to get their precious celebrations over with. I know there a lot of mentally out in the borg I wish everyone could just walk away at once. Losing thousand of witnesses all at once might give the rest a wake up call that something is wrong. gahhh cults

StoneWall

Hi and welcome to the forum dgeero !

Ask your family where in the bible is it required/commanded to go be a "respectful observer" .

Even in their translation it says " as often as you eat this loaf and drink this cup" (never once mentions about going to be a observer)

Once you establish the fact that it's not biblical/scriptural practice, then follow that up with asking them questions about when was this Observer mode started,because it wasn't always a Watchtower/JW requirement (let them research it to help open their eyes)

Hope that helps

Xanthippe

Welcome dgeero. Your family sound very healthy. They put family relationships ahead of the cult. There is definitely hope for them.

Crazyguy

In Matthew chapter 16 or 26 it mentions that the blood means his covenant and in Hebrews chapter 9 it talks about with out his blood there is no forgiveness of sins. Also John chapter six talks about partaking to have life. And John 3 Jesus tells Nicodemus not a follower of Jesus, not a deciple or an apostle three times that one has to be born again in order to enter in to the kingdom of God.

You'll have to review these scriptures to put them into context that you wish to use but to me it's clear if you are not in the new covenant, which they are told they are not and you reject Christs blood then there is no forgiveness of sins and no reason for Jesus to not kill you at the big A.

dgeero

Xanthippe, yes my family has been pretty open minded. My wife and I still do a lot of things with my parents even though they know my objections. I'm really surprised the things I've gotten away with telling them without having the big bad elders serve me a letter to meet with them. I do feel their is hope for them.

Thanks crazy guy for the suggestions that was a similar line of reasoning I had used.

hardtobeme

Hi, dgeero! I just sent you a message.

Vanderhoven7

Try

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLSO2vzNNiA

Giordano

Something has to happen to shake their beliefs, a personal attack by an Elder. a Whisper campaign that slander's them. Finding out that a pedophile has been attending the KH and parents weren't warned.

Does Mom and Dad know that the Elders have to use the two witness rule when it comes to child abuse? That the Society does not encourage Elders to notify the police? That immediate action is postponed for weeks?

Billy the Ex-Bethelite

Welcome!

It's hard to predict what, if anything, will cause someone to finally awaken to TTATT. Dubs like my parents are of the mentality, "where else would we go?" They see many of the flaws in the bOrg, but they are already so invested that they can't just leave.

To use a very Watchtoweresque illustration, WT is like a house on fire. While we're ready to head outside into the unknown and leave behind all our WT investments of time, energy, and money, others are still sitting inside that burning house. They reason, "I can't leave here until there is a newer and better home for me to move into. I've invested so much time, money, and energy in WT that I can't just leave it all. Sure, lots of the original structure has burned to the ground, but the GB just installed wifi and a video projector. Why don't you come back inside and join us for tonight's "pass the wine and crackers" party?"

dgeero

Vanderhoven7 great video! You brought out some great points I had never put it together that the 144000 was pre-tribulation. Thanks! I plan on watching your other videos.

First Post and Using the memorial to wake up family members

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