For Tammy (Tec) - scrutinizing 'revealed' scriptural understanding

SweetBabyCheezits

Continuing Darth's thread I unintentionally hijacked (sorry, again)...

TEC: Um... just in case some of that was directed at me (and if not, I apologize),

Tammy, my comment wasn't directed specifically at you but, in general, at anyone who hastily buys into claims of 'revealed' scriptural understanding without scrutinizing them as carefully as we would WT doctrine. It was kind of an "if the shoe fits" comment. I only want to encourage critical thinking as a defense against misinformation.

Honestly, you seem like a genuinely nice person who has faith but doesn't dogmatically demand everyone else share it. I admire that. But that also makes it frustrating to see nice people opening themselves up to extraordinary claims with no supporting evidence.

I follow no one except Christ, himself. My faith is in Him, and not in man.

I follow no one except Christ, himself. My faith is in Him, and not in man. I did learn from my experience.

I know that's how you feel but for the sake of logical discussion, if you've never personally had a two-way conversation with Christ, how did you first hear about him so that you could develop a relationship?

If you refuse to put faith in man first, then you cannot have faith in Christ. Do you agree? If so, what caused you to put faith in man (which led to faith in Christ)?

I'm not trying to bash your faith, just encouraging a deeper analysis. You can ignore those questions but I would genuinely like to hear from those who still have faith if they recognize what this means at the most fundamental level. For thirty years, I never did.

cult classic

SBC she may have left for vacation. Might have to bump this up in a few days. Unless she checks in while away.

See her last post on the evidence thread.

palmtree67

I think Tammy was planning on being away for the weekend.

You could maybe bump this back to the top on Monday?

SweetBabyCheezits

Okay, will do. Thanks to both.

tec

Sweetbaby - thank you for this thread; I'm touched that you direct it toward me - even if in response to something I said, and understanding that it is also for anyone with similar faith :)

I am on vacation, thanks Palmtree and Cultclassic, so I have only a bit of time. I would like to reflect on this-- If you refuse to put faith in man first, then you cannot have faith in Christ. Do you agree? If so, what caused you to put faith in man (which led to faith in Christ)? -- for a few days before responding in haste. Not just reflect on it to give a better answer ;) but to think about it for myself.

As for your first concern about opening myself up - you don't have to be concerned, not about me. I'm a big girl. I don't leap into things. I listen, I test, I reflect and I definitely scrutinize. I think I'm more open to other people's claims of faith, (open to listen and consider, that is) and the blessings that go with, because I believe those things are possible. At the same time, I can't verify those claims - so I have to concentrate on the words themselves - and let those speak. I do, however, refuse to allow myself to become 'hardened' just because there are charlatons who exist out there, but it is good advice to be wary and to test.

That being said, I greatly appreciate your voice in encouraging people TO scrutinize. It IS good advice, and people can be quite vulnerable coming out of the WTS. If you're encouraging people to do so, out of a genuince concern and kindness - then I appreciate, respect and welcome it.

Tammy

tec

If you refuse to put faith in man first, then you cannot have faith in Christ. Do you agree? If so, what caused you to put faith in man (which led to faith in Christ)?

I'm not trying to bash your faith, just encouraging a deeper analysis. You can ignore those questions but I would genuinely like to hear from those who still have faith if they recognize what this means at the most fundamental level. For thirty years, I never did.

Okay, I've thought it through now :) Sorry it took so long, but it did bear sincere consideration.

I put my faith in man as a child, because that is what children do. I understand this. I was going to answer that as I got older, I could reason for myself and then put my faith in Christ. Of course, that's not thinking clearly through, though is it? Because I'm still putting my faith in the men who wrote about Christ... that they did not lie about him or make him up altogether. Right?

So then I had to think a little more. Because I get soooo comfortable in what I think and believe, that I often forget about the reasons that came before that. But it IS more than having put my faith in man. I believe in the message... and so I put my faith in the message being taught. If Christ existed and taught and lived the way it is recorded, then I find NO LIE in Him and nothing self-serving - only love and peace and mercy for His Father and for us. If he didn't exist, and people took it upon themselves to teach us about a man who taught and lived the way it is recorded... then I find NO LIE in them and nothing self-serving - considering the message, the persecution, imprisonment and executions - only love and peace and mercy. Which then directly contradicts the fact that they could have lied about him to begin with.

So I guess, when all is said and done, it is the love and truth in the message and the man that I have put my faith in. I feel Him, in love. I feel Him, in mercy and forgiveness and peace. And I love Him, truly.

Peace to you, Sweetbaby. Thank you for giving me the opportunity to examine this about myself.

Tammy

startingover

Tammy,

It seems to me that one can take christ out of the equation and nothing would change. It appears you have a passion for what is said about him and what he taught, and you read about it in the bible and like what you hear, but really why does he even have to exist for you to have that passion? Just asking...

tec

I can't take him out of the equation because I didn't fully know love (know as in understand and truly experience) until I loved Him. Can I forget the reason why I came to know love - as if I did it all on my own, when I know I didn't? He also had/has great faith and love for his Father in Heaven. He believed. And I believe Him.

And while I understand that this means nothing to anyone but me -- I feel Him. In love, and in mercy, and in forgiveness. When I feel those things, or when those things are being shown me or others - I see Him in that.

Tammy

For Tammy (Tec) - scrutinizing 'revealed' scriptural understanding

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