I'm being blocked out of frankies thread: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue?

by Deputy Dog 7 Replies latest forum tech-support

  • Deputy Dog
    Deputy Dog

    I'm being blocked out of frankies thread: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue?

    http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/179443/2/Jesus-God-Or-Not-Is-This-A-Salvation-Issue

    The last few post don't show.

  • Chalam
    Chalam

    I think it is a bug on the board.

    You could try from a different browser to see. Here's a couple

    Firefox web browser | Faster, more secure, & customizable

    Apple - Safari - Introducing Safari 4 - See the web in a whole new way

    All the best,

    Stephen

  • Chalam
    Chalam

    Here's the last few posts

    If Jesus was not God, then why didn't he correct Thomas, after Thomas said to him: "My Lord and my God!"?

    ChalamRe: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted ~ an hour ago (7/29/2009)
    Post 1480 of 1486
    Since 12/29/2007

    Hi BC,

    My only impressions of Jesus, as yet, have come from reading the new world translation. I have a lengthy reading list with many topics; it is my intention to read some books about the historicity of Jesus and, as usual, I would like to consider different conclusions on the matter.

    My advise is bin it. You have no doubt seen enough of the WT in action to know their bible is a crock as well.

    Choose any you like the look of here and read 'em for free Book of John :) The only thing is to be open to the Holy Spirit as you speak.

    My feeling right now is that Jesus was very similar to Siddhartha Gotama (the original Buddha). He was a man with no claim to divinity, who tried to influence people to develop compassion-based wisdom in order to lead more fulfilling lives. I think the trappings of organization and religious doctrine group up around him without his intent.

    I am afraid I am with C.S. Lewis on that one. If that is the case Jesus was a deluded liar and a mad man making the claims he did.

    I would read His book and as you do, ask Him who He really is John 14

    If you seek Him, He will respond :)

    All the best,

    Stephen

    Deputy DogRe: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted ~ an hour ago (7/29/2009)
    Post 2511 of 2517
    Since 4/19/2003

    Chalam

    What is Solas BTW?

    Sola scriptura ("by Scripture alone")

    Sola fide ("by faith alone")

    Sola gratia ("by grace alone")

    Solus Christus or ("through Christ alone")

    Soli Deo gloria ("glory to God alone")

    Try these

    Revelation 22:17 Ephesians 2:8 Isaiah 55 Romans 6:23 John 4

    After close examination, these verse seem to be making my point.

    Rev 22:17

    And the Spirit and the bride say, Come! And let the one hearing say, Come! And let the one who is thirsty come. And he willing, let him take of the Water of Life freely.

    Certainly not everyone hears. It seems there is a special call required.

    ChalamRe: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted 45 mins ago (7/29/2009)
    Post 1481 of 1486
    Since 12/29/2007

    Hi DD,

    Certainly not everyone hears. It seems there is a special call required.

    I agree! It is written all over the bible.

    You got to the bottom of this verse at all?

    Matthew 22:14

    All the best,

    Stephen

    Deputy DogRe: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted 41 mins ago (7/29/2009)
    Post 2513 of 2517
    Since 4/19/2003

    Something seems to be wrong I can access the last few posts on this thread.

    bluecanaryRe: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted 38 mins ago (7/29/2009)
    Post 405 of 406
    Since 6/11/2009
    If that is the case Jesus was a deluded liar and a mad man making the claims he did.

    LOL. I wouldn't be surprised. Madness and genious often go hand in hand.

    Deputy DogRe: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted 35 mins ago (7/29/2009)
    Post 2514 of 2517
    Since 4/19/2003

    I'd love to continue the discussion but it seems like I'm locked out of this thread. I can't see any of the responses

    ChalamRe: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted 23 mins ago (7/29/2009)
    Post 1483 of 1486
    Since 12/29/2007

    LOL. I wouldn't be surprised. Madness and genious often go hand in hand.

    Well some though He was mad back in His own day!

    The issue of are the words of Jesus truth or lies is paramount though.

    You need to read them and come to your own conclusion.

    All the best,

    Stephen

  • Heaven
    Heaven

    Looks like a polar bear in a snow storm.

  • Deputy Dog
    Deputy Dog

    Chalam

    They are blank. At least from were I'm sitting.

  • Deputy Dog
    Deputy Dog

    Heaven

    LOL!

    I couldn't have said it better.

  • blondie
    blondie

  • Chalam
    Chalam

    Looks like a polar bear in a snow storm.

    They are blank. At least from were I'm sitting

    Same here but there is a scroll bar at the bottom of the thread to scroll right!

    Anyhow, this should do the bizz-plain text!

    Re: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted ~ 3 hours ago (7/29/2009)

    New Jersey

    Post 3281 of 3281

    Since 12/13/2000

    The burden of truth is on trinitarians to prove that accepting the doctrine of the trinity is essential for salvation.

    Deputy DogRe: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted ~ 3 hours ago (7/29/2009)

    Post 2509 of 2521

    Since 4/19/2003

    Chalam

    how can you know about what Jesus has really done if you don't know who He really is?

    Isn't that were the Holy Spirit comes in?

    "Anyhow, I have another valid question, are we saved by His work or by faith?"

    Well there is that "Golden Chain". We are saved by Grace, through Faith (which is given as a gift, by grace) in His work. You know the "Solas".

    Bottom line is One God=One Savior.

    "Jesus has a free gift of salvation for all, it is up to those that hear about it to take it, not to leave it unopened."

    I'm not so sure we can make this stick, using the bible.

    ChalamRe: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted ~ 3 hours ago (7/29/2009)

    Post 1475 of 1490

    Since 12/29/2007

    The burden of truth is on trinitarians to prove that accepting the doctrine of the trinity is essential for salvation.

    I find no burden to prove the Trinity. I think scripture points to it enough times.

    The burden of proof for salvation is here

    Romans 10:9 (New International Version)

    9That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

    JWs fail twice. They do not believe Jesus is Lord but "Jehovah", look inside the NWT greek scriptures and see countless times where the word "Lord" has been changed to "Jehovah".

    Secondly, JWs say Jesus was raised from the as a "spirit creature". This goes directly against the bible and testimony of Jesus Himself.

    Luke 24:39 (English Standard Version)

    39See my hands and my feet, that it is I myself. Touch me, and see. For a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have."

    Can JWs be saved? You decide.

    All the best,

    Stephen

    Deputy DogRe: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted ~ 3 hours ago (7/29/2009)

    Post 2510 of 2521

    Since 4/19/2003

    bc

    "Is a sincere Christian from the incorrect group doing something wrong? Will Jesus/God overlook their error?"

    I think you need to ask, how does "a sincere Christian" get into the wrong group?

    ChalamRe: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted ~ 3 hours ago (7/29/2009)

    Post 1476 of 1490

    Since 12/29/2007

    Chalam

    Isn't that were the Holy Spirit comes in?

    I agree! Who is giving you these answers, the Holy Spirit? :)

    Well there is that "Golden Chain". We are saved by Grace, through Faith (which is given as a gift, by grace) in His work. You know the "Solas".

    I agree. What is Solas BTW? Don't forget also that faith without works is dead James 2:26

    Bottom line is One God=One Savior.

    Agreed!

    I'm not so sure we can make this stick, using the bible.

    Try these

    Revelation 22:17 Ephesians 2:8 Isaiah 55 Romans 6:23 John 4

    All the best,

    Stephen

    bluecanaryRe: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted ~ 2 hours ago (7/29/2009)

    Post 401 of 407

    Since 6/11/2009

    DeputyDog said: I think you need to ask, how does "a sincere Christian" get into the wrong group?

    By being confused or deceived. I was a sincere Christian as a JW in the sense that I fully believed I was following Christ the way he wanted. Obviously I was wrong. But I believed wholeheartedly that I was right. The moment I stopped believing it was right, I left. But it took 20 years for that to happen.

    Joseph, thank you for your response. Mistakes made by the early Christians were indeed corrected, although not always immediately or all at once. And I think it evident that Jesus would not overlook the false beliefs of any who are aware they are false and purposefully teaching others falsehood.

    What I am wondering about is individuals, rather than entire groups. If an individual is associated with a group that teaches falsehood, but have been fooled into believing it is truth, and does not become aware of that deception before they die, does God hold that against them in judgment? This question is relevant, not just for Christians, but for people in other faiths who have been taught that their particular god or prophet is the true one.

    Stephen said: So what is your interest with the Unitarians? What do you see Jesus as?

    My only impressions of Jesus, as yet, have come from reading the new world translation. I have a lengthy reading list with many topics; it is my intention to read some books about the historicity of Jesus and, as usual, I would like to consider different conclusions on the matter.

    My feeling right now is that Jesus was very similar to Siddhartha Gotama (the original Buddha). He was a man with no claim to divinity, who tried to influence people to develop compassion-based wisdom in order to lead more fulfilling lives. I think the trappings of organization and religious doctrine group up around him without his intent.

    civicsi00Re: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted ~ 2 hours ago (7/29/2009)

    Texas

    Post 468 of 470

    Since 10/24/2007

    If Jesus was not God, then why didn't he correct Thomas, after Thomas said to him: "My Lord and my God!"?

    ChalamRe: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted ~ an hour ago (7/29/2009)

    Post 1480 of 1490

    Since 12/29/2007

    Hi BC,

    My only impressions of Jesus, as yet, have come from reading the new world translation. I have a lengthy reading list with many topics; it is my intention to read some books about the historicity of Jesus and, as usual, I would like to consider different conclusions on the matter.

    My advise is bin it. You have no doubt seen enough of the WT in action to know their bible is a crock as well.

    Choose any you like the look of here and read 'em for free Book of John :) The only thing is to be open to the Holy Spirit as you speak.

    My feeling right now is that Jesus was very similar to Siddhartha Gotama (the original Buddha). He was a man with no claim to divinity, who tried to influence people to develop compassion-based wisdom in order to lead more fulfilling lives. I think the trappings of organization and religious doctrine group up around him without his intent.

    I am afraid I am with C.S. Lewis on that one. If that is the case Jesus was a deluded liar and a mad man making the claims he did.

    I would read His book and as you do, ask Him who He really is John 14

    If you seek Him, He will respond :)

    All the best,

    Stephen

    Deputy DogRe: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted ~ an hour ago (7/29/2009)

    Post 2511 of 2521

    Since 4/19/2003

    Chalam

    What is Solas BTW?

    Sola scriptura ("by Scripture alone")

    Sola fide ("by faith alone")

    Sola gratia ("by grace alone")

    Solus Christus or ("through Christ alone")

    Soli Deo gloria ("glory to God alone")

    Try these

    Revelation 22:17 Ephesians 2:8 Isaiah 55 Romans 6:23 John 4

    After close examination, these verse seem to be making my point.

    Rev 22:17

    And the Spirit and the bride say, Come! And let the one hearing say, Come! And let the one who is thirsty come. And he willing, let him take of the Water of Life freely.

    Certainly not everyone hears. It seems there is a special call required.

    ChalamRe: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted ~ an hour ago (7/29/2009)

    Post 1481 of 1490

    Since 12/29/2007

    Hi DD,

    Certainly not everyone hears. It seems there is a special call required.

    I agree! It is written all over the bible.

    You got to the bottom of this verse at all?

    Matthew 22:14

    All the best,

    Stephen

    Deputy DogRe: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted ~ an hour ago (7/29/2009)

    Post 2513 of 2521

    Since 4/19/2003

    Something seems to be wrong I can access the last few posts on this thread.

    bluecanaryRe: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted ~ an hour ago (7/29/2009)

    Post 405 of 407

    Since 6/11/2009

    If that is the case Jesus was a deluded liar and a mad man making the claims he did.

    LOL. I wouldn't be surprised. Madness and genious often go hand in hand.

    Deputy DogRe: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted ~ an hour ago (7/29/2009)

    Post 2514 of 2521

    Since 4/19/2003

    I'd love to continue the discussion but it seems like I'm locked out of this thread. I can't see any of the responses

    ChalamRe: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted ~ an hour ago (7/29/2009)

    Post 1483 of 1490

    Since 12/29/2007

    LOL. I wouldn't be surprised. Madness and genious often go hand in hand.

    Well some though He was mad back in His own day!

    The issue of are the words of Jesus truth or lies is paramount though.

    You need to read them and come to your own conclusion.

    All the best,

    Stephen

    wobbleRe: Jesus God Or Not? Is This A Salvation Issue? posted 11 mins ago (7/29/2009)

    Post 1223 of 1223

    Since 2/20/2008

    Dear Stephen/chalam,

    If you insist that a person needs to be a Christian to be saved,then indeed there is a great need for a fantastic teaching and preaching campaign to go on throughout the earth,why is Jesus not instigating one ?

    I know of the sterling efforts of various christian organizations,excluding JW's who do not preach the Gospel, but it is a losing battle,more are born than can be converted.

    love

    Wobble

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