(Sorry about the extra post but I really want to hear some feedback on this topic.)
This started off with a reply from Unclepenn:
(Unclepenn please don't take this an attack, it just so happened you raised some issues that I had been meaning to post about)
>my original question< >So with all of those odds stacked up against us, according to the bible we're supposed to ignore all fleshly desires and imitate Jesus a man who was created in perfection.
>Leander, I think your ideas are a bit flawed in this post. We are not asked to just have 'will power' or anything like that. The Holy Spirit has been given to change our desires from serving Satan to serving God. Before I knew Christ I smoked and drank alcohol every day. I used drugs and many other things to keep myself enslaved to my desires. When I got saved, God freed me from those desires. I don't have to get nervous if I am around a bunch of alcohol or drugs. I dont desire that anymore, He changed me from the inside. That is what God wants to do, transform our hearts to serve and please Him. Not by rigorous religious works, but by His Spirit. Interesting topic. Also, God is not just trying to prove a point to mankind or the devil, He has given us freewill and we decide to choose God or reject Him. Are you not pleased with the fact that God gave you freewill and didn't make you like a chatty Kathy doll, when you pull the string you would say "I love you Lord". Instead He gave you a mind, a conscience and a choice. Choose Christ or reject Him. Salvation waits in the balance. I would love to tell you more about it. Email me if you like ( [email protected])
I responded with this:
Unclepenn - I guess the issues I have are with the fact that mankind is for the most part being punished for giving into what comes natural to them as imperfect humans. Its one thing for a perfect person to deviate from normal acceptable desires to something erroneous, but as an imperfect human our basic desires are contrary to whats in the bible.
For example lets look at the area of sex. In our society and in our imperfect state its a perfectly natural thing to want to have sex with those we are attracted to whether we are married to them or not. In fact this view is so prevailing that its almost considered unnatural or extremely rare for a person to reach a certain age without engaging in sex before marriage. Many JWs try to follow the bible's counsel in this matter but many of them either give into their desires, suffer from depression from suppressing those desires or some may be able to get married to satisfy those desires. However even among those who get married to try and avoid sinning they are usually quite a few who find themselves in bad relationships because the only reason they married was to be able to have sex without violating scriptural priniciples.
So the point I'm trying to get at is this, because of sin mankind is strongly inclined to do exactly the opposite of whats in the bible. Its not because people are all evil but its because of their inherited sinful state. To illustrate its like a parent baking a cake and putting that cake in front of hungry children and then telling the children that they will be punished for eating the cake. The cake looks and smells good and all of the children know that it will taste good as well. What do you expect those children to do? Now in addition to the tempatation of the cake, there are some older children in the room. These older kids are using every trick in the book to get the first group children to eat the cake. What do you expect those children to do?
As far as the freewill issue goes I've given that a lot of thought as well. Is it really free will if you have only one option for survival? If someone had a gun to your head and told you to pick up an object or else you would die, what would you do?