ow to find info on who was a Bethelite

by RR 16 Replies latest members private

  • RR
    RR

    I just flew in from Mississippi last night.

    While I was there I was speaking to an elderly Bible Student, we were discussing history, and she told me when she was a little girl, a Br. McCauley (sp?) who was a Watchtower Pilgrim had visited their home in the late 1920s and in discussion had told her moms that there was a brother at bethel who kept trying to push and convince Judge Rutherford of British-Israelism, Rutherford not wanting to hear or even discuss the subject finally had enough and threw the brother out of bethel.

    As a result, this brother formed his own group, his name; Herbert W. Armstrong, his group; the Worldwide Church of God.

    Is there a way to know for sure who was at bethel in the late 1920s? Does anyone know?

    RR

  • fjtoth
    fjtoth

    I knew old Brother McCauley. He was chastised by Rutherford, but it had nothing to do with Herbert W. Armstrong. Armstrong never was one of Jehovah's Witnesses, but like Charles Russell his doctrines sprang from the Second Advent movement and particularly from the Advent Christian Church.

  • minimus
    minimus

    Fjtoth and RR, I wish you'd post more often. Your historical perspective is very much appreciated.

  • fjtoth
    fjtoth

    Minimus,

    "I would if I could but I can't." I enjoy this forum when I have time for it, but due to spending my life in "full-time service" workin' for the Borg, I still gotta work long hours to make a livin'. But I 'preciate your appreciation.

    Frank

  • RR
    RR
    I knew old Brother McCauley. He was chastised by Rutherford, but it had nothing to do with Herbert W. Armstrong.

    I never said McCauley was chatised by Rutherford, I said Armstrong was and McCauley was privy to it.

    Armstrong never was one of Jehovah's Witnesses,

    That's what I'm trying to get at the bottom of. How do you know, where you there?

    RR

  • RR
    RR
    Fjtoth and RR, I wish you'd post more often. Your historical perspective is very much appreciated.

    It's painful coming here you know!

  • Leolaia
    Leolaia

    I have a complete listing of who was at Bethel in April 1930, courtesy of the US Census. Herbert W. Armstrong is not on the list. What is more, he is listed in the 1930 census as a resident of Portland, Multnomah, Oregon (at 839 E. 75th Steet), age 37 (born in Iowa in c. 1892), married to Loma E. Armstrong, who had Garner T. Armstrong (age 2 months) as his youngest son, and who worked in newspaper advertising. This accords with the bio given on Wikipedia:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herbert_W._Armstrong

    Herbert Armstrong was born in Des Moines, Iowa, on July 31, 1892, into a Quaker family.... On a trip back home in 1917, he met Loma Dillon, a schoolteacher and distant cousin from nearby Motor, Iowa. They married shortly thereafter (his 25th birthday on July 31, 1917) and returned to live in Chicago.... His career in advertising began to take off (with his earnings exceeding the equivalent of USD 200,000/year in today's currency). On May 9, 1918, they had their first child, Beverly Lucile Armstrong, and on July 7, 1920, a second daughter, Dorothy Jane Armstrong. In 1924, after several unforseen business setbacks, Armstrong and family moved to Eugene, Oregon where his parents now lived. He continued in the advertising business despite the setbacks.... Once in Oregon, his wife, Loma, who was a Methodist, began spending time with Ora Runcorn and other members of the Church of God (Seventh Day)... On that basis, he and Loma joined the church. Overall, this became the starting point of Armstrong's delving into the Bible, and for several months he devoted virtually all his free time in this pursuit. He would continue his intensive studies of the Bible from 1926 through 1931, delivering his first sermon in 1928 and becoming an ordained minister of the church in 1931. He established a name for himself as a preacher on a number of preaching tours thereafter.

    So I think it's safe to say that Armstrong most likely not in Bethel in the 1920s, at least after 1924. And we know that Armstrong was living in Iowa at least as late as 1921, for that was when his daughter Dorothy was born ... and she is listed as born in "Iowa" in the census. I suspect the story is apocryphal.

  • Kenneson
    Kenneson

    From what I read his greatest influence came from the Church of God, Seventh Day. However, he is believed to have plagiarized from the writings of Seventh Day Adventists, Jehovah's Witnesses and others. I have read nothing about his association with JWs. See

    http://www.exitsupportnetwork.com/artcls/roots.htm#G.G

    There is an interesting comment under Andrew N. Duggar. It says that he wrote in conjunction with Jehovah's Witness C.O. Dodd "A True History of a True Religion" and "was later known to be deliberately falsified." Has anyone ever heard of C.O. Dodd?

  • onacruse
    onacruse

    Here is a list of the "Pilgrims" in 1927, which included many (but not necessarily all) of the Bethelites (from the 1927 Yearbook):

    Akashi, J.
    Amidon, C. F.
    Anderson, C. S.
    Baeuerlein, J. A.
    Ballard, E. E.
    Balzereit, P.
    Banks, T. E.
    Barber, C. W.
    Berber, N. H.
    Barber, R. H.
    Barker, T. E.
    Barnes, W. B.
    Bayless, R.
    Beaty, C. B.
    Beaulieu, E. L.
    Beck, D.
    Bennett, L. R.
    Bergsbaken, E. C.
    Bickert, J. J.
    Bodnar, P.
    Boerner, H.
    Boerner, Theo.
    Bogard, J.
    Bohnet, J. A.
    Bonaccorso, J.
    Bosboyannes, J.
    Bridges, C. P.
    Breadwater, L.
    Bruested, H.
    Buenger, P. M. L.
    Burczyk, O. B.
    Burtch, L. B.
    Burton, R. G.
    Carment, M. L.
    Carr, C. H.
    Casola, M. F.
    Casola, P. A.
    Cattell, F. R.
    Chamberlain, H. L.
    Chomiak, D.
    Chresomalis, E.
    Coble, W. G.
    Comuntzis, T. P.
    Confehr. M. E.
    Cook, P. Y,
    Cook, S. H.
    Cope, J. W.
    Coward, E. J.
    Cutforth, C. W.
    Cutrone, F.
    Dague, J. M.
    Dawson, J.
    Dawson, J. E.
    Deachman, A. L.
    Dean, T. A.
    DeCecea, G.
    DeFehr, J.
    Derderian, D.
    Dey, Wm.
    De Wilda, C.
    Dickerson, W. H.
    Dihlman, W. G.
    Dillard, J. W.
    Dingus, H. H.
    Dinsdale, S. E.
    Dockey, E. L.
    Donald, A.
    Dorziotis, J. G.
    Dougherty, F. H.
    Draper, G. H.
    Dubose, J. B.
    Ebner, R. B.
    Edwardes, J. C.
    Eicher, C.
    Emery, R. S.
    Eshleman, A. D.
    Eshleman, A. J.
    Fekel, C. J.
    Fogh, M. P.
    Franz, F. W.
    Freschel, M.
    Frost, C. E.
    Gamble, R. A.
    Gerdes, C. W.
    Giddings, G. M.
    Goings, C.
    Goux, A. R.
    Graham, A. M.
    Gratteau, J. F.
    Green, R. G.
    Gryniewicz, R.
    Haenger, W. D.
    Hamilton, R. J.
    Hammer, P.
    Hannah, G. E.
    Harbeek, M. C.
    Harding, P.
    Hardy, I. W.
    Harteva, K.
    Hartman, M. L.
    Haslett, D.
    Haughn, J. W.
    Hawkins, H. D.
    Haynych, B.
    Hazlett, H. E.
    Hegner, G. J.
    Hemery, J.
    Herr, M. L.
    Hersee, W. M.
    Hildebrandt, L. F.
    Hill, G. C.
    Hillman, E. L.
    Hodgson, E.
    Hoeprich, K. R.
    Holmes, O. W.
    Homlak, R. J.
    Hoppe, C.
    Howlett, H.
    Howlett, M. A.
    Hudgings, W. F.
    Insberg, A.
    Jackson, C. J.
    Jensen, K. M.
    Johnson, R. A.
    Johnston, Wm.
    Jones, C.
    Jones, G. W.
    Kendall, G. S.
    Kikawec, P.
    Klein, K. F.
    Knorr, N. H.
    Koerber, A.
    Krett, J.
    Kutt, A.
    Kuzma, L.
    Leffler, R. H.
    Lerch, J. E.
    Lindsay, L. M.
    Litwin, G.
    Loeppke, J. A,
    Lowe, E.
    Lung, J. C.
    Luttichau, C.
    Macmillan, A. H.
    MacPherson, J. P,
    Madole, W. J.
    Marchant, A. N.
    Martin, R. J.
    Messner, Geo.
    Miller, G. R.
    Molin, V. L.
    Morton, S.
    Morris, W. O.
    Moser, A. D.
    Murray, H. S.
    Muzikant, J. R.
    Nagel, C,
    Naumetz, J.
    Neskar, T. J.
    Norder, T. H.
    Orrell, E. D.
    Padar, G. L.
    Paine, R. E.
    Palko, M.
    Papageorge, D.
    Pappas, P.
    Park, C. E.
    Payne, L. I.
    Pelle, W. L.
    Perrin, J. H.
    Peterson, W.
    Petrou, H.
    Phill, N.
    Pickering, W. H.
    Pinnock, H. E.
    Pollock, G. R.
    Post, J. C.
    Prosser, C. S.
    Quinn, A. S.
    Rainbow, J. C.
    Ralph, J. E.
    Relnseth, P.
    Rhodes, R. H.
    Rice, B. M.
    Rice, V. C.
    Riemer, H. H.
    Roberts, C.
    Robie, R. L.
    Roemhildt, W.
    Rogers, A. S.
    Rutherford, J. F.
    Salter, W. F.
    Sargeant, W.
    Schmidt, V. F.
    Secord, A. H.
    Seeley, A. L.
    Seeman, E. E.
    Seklemian, H. A,
    Semrau, A.
    Sexton, E. D.
    Shakhashiri, G. J.
    Shaw, J.
    Sheffield, E. B.
    Shuter, S. A.
    Silvey, T. F.
    Sima, J. B.
    Skaudvila, L.
    Smith, D. A.
    Smith, S.
    Spring. W. H.
    Stamoulas, M. A.
    Statuch, M.
    Stewart, C. E.
    Stewart, H. L.
    Sullivan, T. J.
    Szabo, C.
    Szewezyk, J. H.
    Talma, G. L.
    Taliaferro, E. P.
    Thorn, W. J.
    Thornton, T. H.
    Toutjian, R. V.
    Toutjian, S. H.
    Twaroschk, F.
    Twaroschk, G.
    Umlauf, J.
    Vanagas, G.
    Van Amburgh, W. E.
    Van Hyning, R.
    Van Sipma, S. M.
    Wachsmuth, A. T.
    Waicekons, J.
    Wainwright, F.
    Walder, T. A.
    Walrod, R.
    Walter, E. G.
    Watt, J. C.
    Weiss, S.
    Wiberg, C. E.
    Williams, J. B.
    Williams, M.
    Wilson, E. R.
    Wise, C. A.
    Wnorowski, W.
    Wood, W. S.
    Woodworth, C. J.
    Woodworth, W. E.
    Woodworth, W. N.
    Work, R. D.
    Young, Geo.
    Zahnow, C. W.
    Zakian, A. S.
    Zaryski, E.
    Zazist, John,
    Zdunek, F.
    Zink, L. F.
  • Nathan Natas
    Nathan Natas
    I just flew in from Mississippi last night.

    and BOY! are your arms tired!! (yuk yuk yuk!)

    Hi RR,

    Herbert W. Armstrong's autobiography is often available on eBay. In every version of HWA's life story I have read, he stresses that he was NOT one of Jehovah's Witnesses.

    Unfortunately, the census is only taken every ten years and a lot can happen in the meantime. Also, as you know, the Pilgrims eventually became Zone Servants. A list of Zone Servants would not include MOST of the people at Bethel, who have more menial job assignments.

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