by jwbot 9 Replies latest jw friends
"There is no such thing as unconditional love and friendship."
This was said to me by an ex best friend of mine who is still in the religion when I mentioned that the friendship he had with me was conditional because he had shunned me when I didn't do things that he felt was the right path.
I feel this is a pretty sad belief to have...to actually feel that your friends and family only love you under certain conditions? Is this a healthy idea of love to have? Thoughts?
I believe that we have a word for human beings who allow someone to treat them bady - masochist.
A normal human will rightly expect some kind of reciprocal kind treatment from a friend, so i would agree that there is no such thing as ABSOLUTELY unconditional love and friendship.
Having said that, I think the range of tolerance is far greater among XJWs than it is among JWs, whose "New World Society" is an exclusive club with ridgid rules for any who wish to join.
There is no such thing as unconditional love and friendship."
I feel this is a pretty sad belief to have...to actually feel that your friends and family only love you under certain conditions? Is this a healthy idea of love to have? Thoughts?
I have a letter written by a very JW and very close friend of my family that says the same thing. And I have even seen people on this board say ‘there is no such thing as unconditional love.’
I believe that they are ‘sort of right.’ OK, sure, maybe all love does have some kind of conditions, because there are no absolutes in this world.
Like if someone I loved killed my mother, I would not love them anymore.
I don’t think that when most people say ‘unconditional love’ they really mean they would love the person ‘even if they did the worst thing imaginable.’
When I say I love someone unconditionally, I mean that I love them for who they really are inside, and I will continue to love them all along their journey of life as they change and grow, even if they change and grow away from me. Because I love them, not their actions.
Perhaps someone I love like this could loose my love, but that would have to be because of an exceptional situation. Of course it is possible.
But I would not stop loving this person because they dyed their hair, or because they married someone I hated, or because they changed religions, or dropped out of school, or divorced, or started smoking, or anything so TRIVIAL.
So is that really ‘unconditional love’? Isn’t REAL ‘unconditional love’ just another name for ‘PERFECT love’? Of course we are not perfect, so we can’t love perfectly. But we try. We do the best we can.
I believe there is such a thing as 'unconditional love.'
'Unconditional love' is really the name we have for: 'the very best love a person have give.'
It is understood to not be literally 100% unconditional, because that is impossible.
And we are not proud of the fact that sometimes we stop loving a person. It cannot be helped sometimes. Most people feel kinda bad about that. Almost sorry.
But not JWs. They are PROUD of their ability to stop loving in an instant.
I could never belong to a religion where it is considered ‘good’ to stop loving a person.
A religion like that would be teaching that black is white, up is down, and bad is good.
I am rambling now. Venting. I’ll stop now.
Love,
-Lisabobeesa
Lisa... that was a great post!
I remember once arguing with a Dub who was trying to insist that God's love is conditional. But I guess thats something that they get from the Borg, too.
Wow, excellant posts guys. Thanks!
LisaBoBeesa
You said
"When I Love someone unconditionally, I mean that I love them for who they really are inside, and will continue to love them all along their journey of life as they change and grow, even if they change and grow away from me. Because I love them, not their actions."
And thats it in a nutshell.. You love them enough to allow them freedom of thought, freedom to change and grow. You are so right.
I think when it comes to being disowned by ones family that the words I love you from such ones is so EMPTY. Empty words, that cannot be backed up with touch, association, a mutual sharing of any thoughts, no support in life's road,
If faith without works is dead.. would not love with works be the same..(it becomes conditional)
It's "dead love"
J.W. teaching do not allow that good type of love but are restrictive and as you say "BLACK AND WHITE"..
Where does that leave room for the human spirit, human frailties, and a whole host of where people came from. The conditions that affected them from their pasts and their dysfunctional families.
All families are dysfunctional in some ways.. And J.W.'s leave no room for that aspect..of human fraility.
they leave only JUDGEMENT.
And lisabobeesa.. you are not rambling.
I think the purest time I have felt the highest levels of unconditional love was when I first looked into the eyes of my newborn children and held them for the first time.
They are so pure, so unaffected yet by my ways of thinking.
No , your not rambling.. because ...now I am, as I stare far away out the window I'm sitting by.
Special K
The funny thing is that the JWs who post on their DBS don't know that the WTS teaches there is no unconditional love. They will argue with you vehemently that there is.
The term unconditional love never appears in the WTS publications.
The only concept the WTS says is unconditional is personal baptism.
w99 5/15 19
First: We view ourselves as belonging to Jehovah God, having individually dedicated ourselves to him unconditionally , and we shall maintain unshakable faith in Jehovah’s provision of the ransom through his Son, Jesus Christ.
But life on earth is conditional as taught by the WTS.
w99 10/15 6
Eternal life was conditional , though. Adam had to collaborate with and be obedient to the Source of life, his Creator, in order to maintain his life perpetually.w95 10/15 9-10
In an expression of his great love , Jehovah gave his earthly children life and provided them with a marvelous place to live in—a beautiful paradise . Yet, this wonderful gift was not unconditional . In effect, it was given in trust. Our first parents were to care for their home and expand it until they had populated and subdued the whole earth. They had privileges and responsibilities toward the land animals, the birds, and the fish—all other living creatures that would share the earth with them and their offspring. For this great trust, man would be accountable.w60 5/15 291
In the first place , all God’s gifts are conditional . He therefore rightfully requires that those who receive his gifts show appreciation by making the best possible use of them. As the great Teacher, Jesus Christ, once put it: "When you have done all the things assigned to you, say, ‘We are good-for-nothing slaves. What we have done is what we ought to have done.’"—Luke 17:10.
Having thought about this a little more, I would say that the purpose of conditional love is behavior modification; it is a control technique.
So to alter your question just a little bit, is there such a thing as non-manipulative, non-controlling love? I think so; but you won't find it in the WTB&TS.
The term unconditional love never appears in the WTS publications.The only concept the WTS says is unconditional is personal baptism.
Wow, that is something else. Wow. They really spell it out. Thanks for the quotes, Blondie. It blows my mind how they think. But when I read these quotes, I realize they couldn't possibly think any other way if they swallow this stuff.
"There is no such thing as unconditional love and friendship."
It's unquestionably true. Just think about it.
