Should WTS Charge Interest?

by Amazing 12 Replies latest jw friends

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  Amazing

  When I first became Accounts Servant (before the Elder/MS structure) I was surprised to learn that the Watchtower Society charged interest on Kingdom Hall loans. The rate was 3%. Typical interest rates from commercial lenders on home mortgages at the time was about 6% to 7% ... I questioned the practice, and the JW man who turned to accounts records over to me made the point that inflation was about 3% or 4%, and therefore, the Soceity was merely getting back the same buying power it had when it loaned the money ... and it beat bank rates, so he saw nothing wrong with it. I eventually adopted this view.

  I was troubled because of the Bible verse that says not to charge our brothers interest. The actual verses were talking about charging interest when our brother is in need. The idea was not to take advantage of our brother's unfortunate situation. In other verses, however, Jesus used the illustration of the Master leaving assets with his servants and upon returning from a long journey, expecting what is his with interest ... this was an illustration, but Jesus used a common practice to teach something he was inferring was honorable.

  Originally, the Kingdom Hall fund, as told to me by older JWs, was a private fund where the 3% charge was a condition of the donated fund, and was designed only to offset the effects of inflation. However, in the 1980s and 1990s the Kingdom Hall building funds grew significantly with the quick-build program ... so the funds are donated by the JWs in the forst place ... and it seems that loaning back out, especially to poorer congregations, at no interest, would have been a kinder thing to do. Though 3% is not a lot of interest, the gesture alone would have endeared poorer JWs to the Society.

  Now that the Society is the beneficiary of Kingdom Hall real property in the event of the demise of a congregation, then they inherit what the JWs paid for with work, materials, and borrowed money at interest ... and then any appreciation in value all go to the Society ... I don't know, but it just seems like the kinder, nicer Watchtower died a long time ago. What JWs have today is the full-fleged wolf with all Sheep's cl;othing removed, collecting his interest and profits on the backs of hardworking JWs - all in the name of their god.
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  Scully

  Y'know Amazing......

  Something that bothered me about the WTS charging interest on KH loans, was the fact that the WTS routinely (on an annual basis) solicits funds in their magazines, including INTEREST FREE LOANS.

  Now how on earth an entity that's charging interest on loans of money that originally comes from the people who donated it in the first place could have the brass cojones to insist on loans coming to them be INTEREST FREE is just mind boggling.

  Oddly enough, my dad made a loan of this kind to the WTS many years ago. I don't think he's ever asked for his money to be repaid either. Maybe that's what the WTS was counting on.

  Love, Scully
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  The Alchemist

  Get This Amazing. My friend's mother's Hall in Arizona is finally paid for but it is sitting on some very valuable real estate. So What happens? The "beneviolent and kind" WT society tells them to sell it. Guess who gets the money...the WTBS. A new hall is built and and with it a new mortgage with the payments going to the Society at 3% interest!...The Society is an expert like a magician distracting you with one hand (3% inflation loans, free home Bible (book) studys and contrabution only litter-ature) while the other hand fleeces your pockets. Dave
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  eyeslice

  Amazing,
  You need to be careful with the interest thing.

  I know for a fact that in the UK, no interest is charged on loans, any money borrowed being repayable interest free over a period of 120 to 180 months.

  What is slightly questionable is this, given that these are genuine loans that are repaid to the society, not donations from the society, and congregations are still still donating to the society's KH fund, is not the 'pot' from which they are lending getting ever greater?

  Given there are not an infinite number of KHs to be built, but all congregations are encourage to donate to the KH hall fund, all I can see is that this pot will get bigger and bigger, else they donate the money to other lands, e.g. Africa for the continuance of the work there.

  I have problems with many doctrines now days, but I am not sure that you can read anything into the morals of how the society handles financial matters. I do not believe them to be total hypocrites in the respect.
• 

  roybatty

  A few years back I was on an elder body of a congregation that was building a new KH. It bothered me very much that the Society was charging the congregation interest on money that wasn't really theirs! It was the money given by the "brothers and sisters" worldwide to help others. I was also told that the 3 - 4 % just covered inflation and banking fees. Well, 3 - 4 % on millions of dollars sounds like a great deal to me for a non-profit organIzation. However, I have heard that the boys in Crooklyn no longer charge any interest on KH loans.

  Edited by - roybatty on 18 July 2002 11:40:25
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  NameWithheld

  eyeslice - Amazing is just telling it like it is (or at least like it was in the USA until recently).

  Step 1) Local congos take Bros/Sis $$$ for the 'KH Building Fund'. Congos send $$$ to Brooklyn.

  Step 2) Brooklyn invests said $$$ whereever it is that they invest these things. If you don't think that they invest those huge amounts of $$$ you're crazy! So they are now making 3-15% on the $$$ that came right out of Mr Average JW's pocket.

  Step 3) COs 'tell' 'encourage' whatever you want to call it, the local congo that it is time to build a new hall. Local Bros take a loan from Brooklyn to pay for land and hall. Proceeds from the old hall's sale go to Brooklyn (and HOW they justify THAT one I'll never know!)

  Step 4) Local Bros/Sis are 'reminded' every month that the mortgage on the hall is due, please donate to the local hall's contribution box. $$$ are sent to Brookyln, which are then invested.

  Step 5) Rinse and repeat as often as needed!

  As an example, I was at a hall a few years ago, it was built in the early 90's or so, remodeled in the mid-90's, and was generally about half full on Sundays. Last I heard about 3/4 years ago, the CO was telling them they needed a NEW hall!??? When it was only half full! But this one was paid for, so no more $$$ were flowing to Brookyln. I don't know what excuse they were using to try and pass it off, but the local avg Jws were NOT happy about it.

  I swear, I don't see how those involved in the entire hall building process cannot see through it to the giant $$$ making scheme it is!

  This doesn't even touch the building process wherein the Regional Building Commitee dictates everything from where, when and how it's built to the vendors that will be used in buying building materials.
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  Wren

  Finding ways of getting a new KH mortgage after the old one is paid off is new hard hitting news to me. How many ways can WT fleece a sheep!? I wonder if any cong. ever tried to fight it.
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  minimus

  Amazing, didn't you, a while back, say something to the effect that you didn't think that this was unfair or unreasonable?....or am I mistaken?
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  NameWithheld

  Wren, I know of probably 4 or 5 KHs that were embroiled in 'battles' with C.O.s at one time or another over KH building matters. One hall in a poor(er) town is pretty old, somewhat nappy, etc, but paid for and not close to being full (still). Needless to say the pressure from above to build a new hall is strong, but the locals see no need as it's PAID FOR - and convenient locations for most of the JWs. And property is never cheap.

  Other halls were similar stories - look at how many fairly new halls are abandonded or remodeled just a few years after being built!
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  Wren

  NameWithheld, thanks for info. We purposely tried to not get involved with WT building/real estate when we were in, although we are building contractors. Going back for another mortgage to people that, for the most part, are struggling financially & vulnerable, hit me as disgusting. Another tactic to maintain their real estate empire.