Old Seats or New Seats?

by Duncan 9 Replies latest jw friends

  • Duncan
    Duncan

    Every now and again we discuss on this forum the degree of control that The Society enjoys over its members – the rank and file. That there IS huge control is beyond dispute, I would guess. But there’s more to it than just a simple predatory attitude from Brooklyn (though that’s there, for sure). There’s a complicit attitude from the congregation itself.

    Your average dub, just WANTS to be told what to do and think.

    I was thinking back – this is around 1970 - to when we, in our local KH, were discussing leaving the somewhat run-down rented accommodation we were in and building a new modern Kingdom Hall in the middle of town.

    One of the items that came up for discussion on a Tuesday night Service Meeting was to do with the seating to be used in the new building. The choice before us was to re-use the old-fashioned, but rather comfy and generously-padded seats that were in use in the old place (bought years earlier as a job-lot from an old cinema about to be demolished) – or go for a brand-new look, nice modern office-style seating that would be a credit to the Hall.

    How to vote?

    I was as undecided as anyone else there. The brother on the platform outlining the issue was trying to be neutral about it, clearly wanting the brothers to decide for themselves (“it’s your money we’re spending, brothers!”) but seemed to me to be leaning towards the “Get New ” school. Others from the floor responded that there was nothing wrong with what we had. I don’t know if this is the way things relating to a new KH are decided these days – but on that occasion it was going to be settled by a show of hands that night.

    The congregation was in a total dither. Jesus didn’t know how right he was when he spoke about his “sheep”. “ Baaa-aaa - what d’you think?” “ Baaa-aa - I dunno, what do you think?”

    Finally, the Congregation Servant was asked to comment from the floor (this must have been just a few months before the whole Body-of-Elders thing came in). This chap, who would be the first PO, and had been our Overseer as long as I could remember, was looked to as, well, simply being right about everything. He was Brother Smith, The Overseer. He knew What Was Best.

    And I remember his comments so well, the effect was so immediate.

    He said: “ Well, it’s not for me to say - new chairs might certainly look nice, but I know which ones I’d rather sit on!”

    Phew! That was it! At last! No tiresome decision necessary! We had been given the right answer! It wasn’t just me, feeling this sense of relief - the sentiment was palpable in the room.

    The vote was taken shortly thereafter, and was completely unanimous. Old chairs for us! Thank goodness Brother Smith told us what the right answer was!

    I’ve always remembered this:

    The helpless sense of so wanting to give the “right answer” but not trusting ourselves to know what that right answer was.

    The relief we felt upon being told what the right answer was.

    The sense of joy in putting up my hand to vote the “right” way in order to endorse the “right” answer. To be seen on the “right” side of the question.

    All over a miniscule, poxy little issue like seating!

    “Sheep” alright!

    Anyway, the irony is that the old Hall actually burned down a couple of months later, actually just as the build on the new place was about to get underway. So – new seats it was, as it turned out.

    Maybe it was Jehovah who lit the match, correcting his wayward people from their wrong furniture-decision. Mysterious ways and all that - Who knows?

    Duncan.

  • AlanF
    AlanF

    You're so right about Dubs wanting to be told what to do and what to think, Duncan. I've heard so many times some JW saying that they're so glad they don't have to think about hard questions, because the Society does their thinking for them. Even elders are often all too happy to be told what to do. One typically loyal and unthinking elder recently expressed to me his happiness that he and his buddies don't have to think about child molestation issues at all -- all they have to do is call the Society and be told what to do. I heard one elder years ago, on being asked about what he thought about some subject not clearly ruled upon by Brooklyn, say something like, "If the Society doesn't say anything about it, I don't bother with it." Talk about prostituting one's brain to a cult!

    My ex-wife turned out to be one of these unthinking sorts. She literally would not put one foot in front of the other unless she knew exactly why she should move the foot, exactly where it was going to land, and the consequences of moving it from one point to another. This resulted in some difficulty when hiking. The JW religion is ideally suited to such a person.

    It seems to me that the JW religion attracts people who hate to think for themselves. Look at the conversion process. A potential convert is presented with a lot of self-inconsistent material which he has to swallow, but at first only the more reasonable stuff is presented. Once that is accepted and the student comes to trust the teacher, the more ridiculous notions are gradually introduced -- things like the "faithful slave" doctrine. If the student is stupid enough to accept these, then the JWs have found an ideal non-thinker; otherwise the person quits the study. The situation with a born-and-raised JW is a bit different, because he or she is trained in the art of non-thinking. He develops his social circle almost entirely within the non-thinking JW community, so it takes a lot more effort to overcome the training and social pressure, begin thinking for himself, and get out.

    AlanF

  • Latte
    Latte

    Duncan,

    The choice before us was to re-use the old-fashioned, but rather comfy and generously-padded seats that were in use in the old place (bought years earlier as a job-lot from an old cinema about to be demolished)
    At first I thought you were someone from my old hall posting…..….lol
    Seems that re-cycling old cinema chairs were the in thing! Not bad for my hubby to have a nap on I suppose……but that’s about it! They are really awful to look at! Also the poor kid's really struggled to not make them rock throughout the sneeting......what's a child supposed to do on such a chair? lol

    Old chairs for us! Thank goodness Brother Smith told us what the right answer was!
    Anything will do!

    Thank goodness Brother Smith told us what the right answer was!
    Clearly the man was inspired!

    The hot debate in our hall, was alway's about the purchase of an Hoover.........lol lol. Many a time we had to take our own as the body of elders didn'y really see the import of having one..........[8>]

    Latte

  • Angharad
    Angharad

    Latte

    There was once a very embarssing announcment in our hall.

    "Could whoever has taken the hoover home with them please bring it back"

    I dont know if it was ever returned, but the question of who had swiped the hoover was the talk of the hall for a while!

  • Latte
    Latte

    Angharad,

    That's terrible! [8>] (lol)

    For our hall the question of purchasing a 'good' hoover went on for years. I, many a time took my own to do the work. The PO. ALWAYS supervised the cleaning.......NEVER did I see him lift a finger!
    So, you can see just why the body of elder's being all male found it a challenging question: Hoover...or not?

    Nuff' said LOL

    Latte

  • teenyuck
    teenyuck

    AlanF-

    You make a very good point on the seeming inability of JW's to think for themselves. I agree.

    It seems to me that the JW religion attracts people who hate to think for themselves
    Look back at the literature...when one studied the mags or books for discussion, the answer was already there; look farther down and you had the answer to the questions asked during the Sunday study hall (it that what it was called? it has been 18 years) I remember highlighting the answers. We did not have to think about the information from the bible, we had the WTBTS intrepretation and that is what we should memorize.

    When I got to high school and college and had to THINK and then answer, it became much more difficult to form opinions and ideas.

    The situation with a born-and-raised JW is a bit different, because he or she is trained in the art of non-thinking. He develops his social circle almost entirely within the non-thinking JW community, so it takes a lot more effort to overcome the training and social pressure, begin thinking for himself, and get out.
    That is true...it took a long time for me to overcome my inability to really read something and form an opinion or come up with a solution. I expected the book or literature to have the answer.
  • hillary_step
    hillary_step

    Duncan,

    Interesting post and coincidentally, an issue that my wife and I were discussing this morning.

    She reminded me of a Service Meeting talk I gave a couple of years ago when I drew attention to the falling publisher figures in the Western world in a relished technicolor, doling out the depressing figures with a worrying honesty.

    The congregation fidgeted nervously, many looked at one another, some at their shoes, others seemed mesmorised by their children.

    The following week another elder chose to use his item to show the 'dramatic' increases among the publishers in various parts of the world, obviously having to chose the more underdeveloped countries.

    This time the congregation breathed easily, many purposefully approached me afterward and mentioned how thrilling it was to see this increase, totally disregarding the true nature of the statistics.

    They believed what they needed to believe to propagate the mind-set installed within them by the WTS. Of course, this is the classic behavior of those fed a steady diet of 'exclusivity pie', cognitive dissonace develped into an art form.

    On another thought Duncan. You must admit, Bro. Smith was a little special. I remember having deep discussions about Aldous Huxley with him, he loved his literature. I also loved the way he would virtually climb onto the podium and drape himself casually over his notes like a drunken theological 'lounge-lizard'.

    Still recall the strange smell of that rented hall and the booming personality of BP.

    Best regards - HS

  • 25ashitaka25
    25ashitaka25

    'Your average dub, just WANTS to be told what to do and think.'

    That's my father all over. For them it's like a warm blanket. My mother, who is DA'ing herself, is quite the opposite. From day one she had problems with elders telling her what to do-she promptly told them where to go. Good ol' mom.

    They become afriad of the Big A, and then they start to fear everything. Dependency and depression result.

    ashi

  • teenyuck
    teenyuck

    ashi-

    you wrote

    My mother, who is DA'ing herself, is quite the opposite. From day one she had problems with elders telling her what to do-she promptly told them where to go. Good ol' mom.
    I am happy for your mother.

    My mother turns into a meek, cowering "sheep" the moment she walks into the KH. I do not understand this. It is a phychological button. She has opinions (not well informed-she does not read news, but, watches Oprah) and is a business ownwer; when I ask how she can accept being told she is inferior because she is female and should be in subjection she gives the canned answer-"That is what Jehovah wants."

    I will never give up the hope that she will someday leave the borg.

  • Duncan
    Duncan
    On another thought Duncan. You must admit, Bro. Smith was a little special

    Hillary, he absolutely was.

    I recall the year when we held the memorial in a hired hall, twice the size of the local KH. He walked up on stage, put the lectern to one side, and just stood and spoke without notes for the entire thing.

    He was exceptional. A spell-binding speaker, and I suppose deserved the deference and respect he got. If he wanted comfy-but-old fashioned chairs, that's what we were going to vote for!

    I've no idea if he's still even alive (or BP come to that).

    regards,

    Duncan.

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