by dmouse 9 Replies latest jw friends
My father-in-law and brother-in-law are both off to the elder's school in Dudley, England this weekend.
Can anyone enlighten me as to what they find to talk about for two days? What is special about this meeting that can't be handled thorough normal channels?
Thanks,
Dean.
Hi dmouse: Elder school is much like a Circuit Assembly, but made up of Elders and possibly MSs. The Society often assigns the Circuit and District Overseers, and maybe one or two highly respected and recognized local Elders (often these are used as substitute Circuit Overseers, and Assembly Overseers) to conduct the meeting.
In the ones I attended, recorders, cameras, videos, and notepads were not permitted. Those Elders who have the "Flock" book are permitted and encouraged to take notes in their books. Elders who do not have Flock books, will make notes in their Bible covers. The CO or DO will say what page in the Flock book to turn to and point where to add certain modifications, or changes.
The while the meeting can be, and often is, rather boring, it is mostly about reminders of how to handle congregation business, care for the Field Service work, how to train and better promote Ministerial Servants so they are able to handle more load, and become Elders. How to balance out family life with Elder work.
Sometimes they make organizational changes, such as to who in the Congregation should correspond with the Society, i.e. when they changed from having the Secretary as the primary contact to having a permanent PO be the primary contact. They also cover BOW letters and make sure all Elders are made aware of certain letters in case the PO or Secretary did not share these with the Body of Elders.
They announce "Refinements" (choke, cough, wheeze) in how to handle Judicial matters, such as changed definitions in what constitutes fornication, adultry, and things like that. These will include discussions of case examples so that the Elders can grasp these 'refinements.'
The most fascinating School I attended was the one where we were told that an Elder does not have to be removed for serious sins IF the sin was committed two or three years prior, and the Elder still maintained the respect of the Congregation, and the sin was not generally known among the Congregation. They District Overseer cited a KM from 1974 that essentially stated the same thing in the Question Box, but then he elaborated on it by specifically mentioning that a serious sin could include adultry. They also stated that an MS could be given similar latitude. But that regular Publishers and even Pioneers, if not Elders or MS would still have to be disciplined. I made posts on this on H20 and on this forum, citing and quoting the specific KM.
So, aside from some juicy chage like I mention, the meetings are not much different than when the CO meets with the Elders at the congregation level. They are a boring rehash of things Elders already know, but with emphasis on certain items that the CO and DO and Society feel needs attention. The only other difference is that th meetings often last two days, and contain a lot of coverage of a lot of material. There can be a question and answer period, but most Elders are shy about asking questions because the Co and DO can blind-side them with a sarcastic response, making the Elder asking the questions to look like an idiot.
Also, when these are two day sessions, often the first day includes both the MS and Elders. The Society wants MS trained too, but have the Elders there to know what is being said so they can continue the points with the MSs. And the second day is often for Elders only.
At Circuit Assemblies, often on Saturday about noon, the CO and DO meet with all the Elders in the Circuit in private. And these meetings are pretty much like the two day schools, but only contain a few points. And they also discuss needs specific to the Circuit, such as getting a car or insurance for the DO or CO, or a planned Assembly Hall work, or the status of the Circuit's budget, and other such routine and normally boring crud. - Amazing
Excellent summary. Elders school, even more boring then the circuit assembly. I use to wait for this earth-shaking revelations about "the truth" only to be disappointed. One thing I did learn from attending the elders school, it's just a business. I felt like I was at some business seminar learning the latest managerial techniques.
Orgies. Big, wild, intoxicating, degenerate, masochistic, sadistic, smelly, orgies. Ever wonder why they don't have videos of the school? That way there's no evidence other than the scars, cuts, bruises, and stains.
I don't need to fight
To prove I'm right
I don't need to be forgiven.
Amazing has done a fine job of explaining what happens at elders' schools. Lately, though, elders are encouraged to take notes on a pad, and to write notes in their Flock books, but are still not allowed to record anything or to take notes on a computer.
An elder who attended a recent KM school sent me a few notes he thought were particularly noteworthy:
-- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
Never give out the names to the police or press of anybody in the Legal Dept.
Never refer to the Society as an entity in any letters that involve disfellowshipping. Verbal correspondence is safer.
The ideal is to have nothing at all to do with our disfellowshipped family members if possible. It may be hard to do but will
please God.
All scanned forms and other documents or letters pertaining to the WTS must be erased from hard disks as soon as we arrived at
our homes.
Inactive Publishers are to be viewed as still totally under Gods laws. -- just because a person has been absent from meetings
does not mean that his sin can be overlooked.
As soon as anybody is accused or confesses to child-abuse, say absolutely nothing but contact the Legal Dept by telephone
immediately.
Never utter one word to the newspapers or police. Say to them - ‘I must speak to my Lawyers first’, and then telephone Legal
immediately. This includes any questioning over any refugees we may have in our congregations.
Always announce reproof whenever a child molester has been dealt with. Congregations must be warned of such people.
Never, in dealing with marital problems should the words ‘can’t’/‘should’ (as in you can’t/should leave your mate) be used.
Regarding Blood - As medical technology develops we may need to change our views yet again on what we consider acceptable or
not. (Branch Coordinator)
We need to remind ourselves that we know that the FDS has been appointed by God over ALL his belongings, so how do you
respond to its direction? Some elders have been noticed ridiculing the direction of the FDS. What they need to realize is that
they are actually ridiculing Christ.
A new arrangement for counting time for the very old and invalids among us will start soon. Qualified invalids will be allowed to count as little as 15 minutes a month and still remain 'regular publishers'. This loving arrangement is from Jehovah.
The following was repeated five times: Under no circumstances should an elder ever, ever, ever visit a sister alone.
Quotes to bring a smile to your face:
Branch Coordinator - ‘Worldly people read the Bible, but in a perfunctory way, without real understanding. We however read it
with real discernment’.
Jehovah takes very seriously someone who withholds the truth from a person who has the right to know it.
It is very dangerous to introduce secular research into the congregation - these writings will not help us get eternal life.
The GB have at their disposal the best Biblical researchers available. They do your research for you and provide you with the
cream.
Even some in Bethel have had to be dismissed because they became spiritually weak after reading things on the Internet.
Some women work outside of the home to elevate their standard of living. This way they develop their own sense of
independence, and this can be very dangerous.
Our enemies say that we are opposed to JW’s to having a good education. We are not. What we are opposed to is education for no
purpose.
-- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
AlanF
Amazing,
I attended was the one where we were told that an Elder does not have to be removed for serious sins IF the sin was committed two or three years prior, and the Elder still maintained the respect of the Congregation, and the sin was not generally known among the Congregation. They District Overseer cited a KM from 1974 that essentially stated the same thing in the Question Box, but then he elaborated on it by specifically mentioning that a serious sin could include adultery.
Yes, I remember that one, I think that this was around '86.
Apparently the KM used to support the ‘new’ view was actually supposed to help elders to deal with the more minor issues like smoking and the occasional paralytic drunk. . Some DO's & CO's obviously got hold of the wrong end of the stick; understandably, given the ambiguity in the way the KM handled the question, and began teaching what you outline above.
I wrote to the Branch in the Country I was serving in at the time for clarification and they sent back a blistering letter dismantling the whole idea of what had been taught at the elders school.
As if by example, the following week they removed one of the Branch Servants and booted him back into his 'civies, for a sin he had committed, are you listening, twenty five years previously.
Best regards Amazing - HS
DMouse,
I have attended special Elder meetings at the Dudley Assembly Hall. (It's across the road from the Zoo). In addition to being boring, the occasions have no food or even hot drinks, you had to bring your own. But the worst thing is that they are always held on holidays. I bet one of the meetings is on New Year's day? (Weekends are needed for assemblies.) I never got to enjoy that holiday with the family and you couldn't stay up late on New Year's eve either.
Thirdson
Thanks for your replies everyone...some interesting reading!
<<Even some in Bethel have had to be dismissed because they became spiritually weak after reading things on the Internet.>>
Nice to know we are reaching even into the inner sanctums! I wonder if the net will be banned for Bethel members eventually.
<<Always announce reproof whenever a child molester has been dealt with. Congregations must be warned of such people>>
About time.
I talked to Elders in two different areas of the country and both said that there were only a very small number of elders under 50. In each case there were about 600 elders in attendance.
It appears they aren't going to be able to make the jump to the next generation. I know a lot of young men in the organzation who have been disqualified because they frankly admit they occasionally will go to an R rated movie. Others are disqualified because they like to go to rock concerts, wear unacceptable clothing styles, or are trying to get an education at four year colleges.
If this trend continues then things could turn out as Metatron often predicts.
I always pictured Elder's school as being kind of like Hogwort's. You
know, elders flying on broomsticks and learning the latest spells and
potions to try on their congregations.
By coincidence, I have two elders from out of town staying at my house
right now (one is my wife's uncle). The elder's school is today and
tomorrow. I can hardly wait to see if they look any wiser tonight.
