Re New Blood card, Statement of Witnesses

stevenyc

Thank you poppy for the scan at: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/16/104206/1.ashx

What would happen if I refused to sign the no-blood card, and carry it with me?

The statement of witnesses states that I am under 'no duress or undue influence'. So, I could presume that if I refuse to sign this document, I would still maintain my position in the religion. With no effect on how my community interacts with me, both spirituality and financially.

It also says that 'no fraud' occurred as to my decisions. Now I see the potential 'big news' from Barbara. I, as a person consenting to blood refusal, am instructed to review the June 15, 2004, watchtower, which refers me to the 1990 How Can Blood Save Your Life? booklet. If I based my decision to refuse blood, on the information in the blood tract, and that the witnesses also saw this as truth, and not fraud, then I think I could have a case against them.

steve

stevenyc

well I thought it was interesting ...

steve

hubert

Thanks, Steve, I find it very interesting, too. I'm glad you posted this.

Hubert

Elsewhere

Thank you poppy for the scan at: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/16/104206/1.ashx
What would happen if I refused to sign the no-blood card, and carry it with me?
The statement of witnesses states that I am under 'no duress or undue influence'. So, I could presume that if I refuse to sign this document, I would still maintain my position in the religion. With no effect on how my community interacts with me, both spirituality and financially.
It also says that 'no fraud' occurred as to my decisions.

Yeah, lets see if a contract like that holds up when you find out that your car dealer scammed you. Sure, you didn't know it was fraud as it was happening, but you did discover the fraud afterward.

That's just the lawyers grasping at straws because they know the WTS is screwed.

blondie

Actually the WTS started holding the little card signing ceremonies after the book studies when it became evident that many JWs had not signed their cards and/or had them witnessed. The WTS reps would find out at the hospital (or on one occasion when the cards were used to determine if JWs had enough seniority to qualify for the Insight books--or was that the Proclaimers book?). They discovered that many old-timers had neglected to fill out their cards properly.

All you have to do to avoid signing is to avoid that book study and if the "overseer" asks to see it later, just assure him that you have "taken care of it." What is he going to do, grab your wallet or purse and look through it. I'd hit him up side the head. My experience was they were not that interested. They are more interested in if you turned in your time slip.

Blondie

stillajwexelder

or on one occasion when the cards were used to determine if JWs had enough seniority to qualify for the Insight books--or was that the Proclaimers book?)

Insight books were in short supply blondie but you had to pay for them. The Proclaimers book was released (after the "voluntary" donation arrangement came in) and you had to be an elder, MS, Reg pioneer or baptised over 30 years to get a copy - and even then only one per family.

stillajwexelder

To stay on topic, get a blood card, even get it signed , but I never carried mine - nor have I done for about 8 years now. I call it Theocratic Warfare Strategy

Elsewhere

Speaking of coercion... does the WTS still "card" people before allowing them in certain private JW functions? I remember being asked to show them my "blood card" to prove I was a JW.

Does this mean that one is not a JW if one does not have a “blood card”?

blondie

I've never been "carded" for any JW event, Elsewhere. I didn't get invited to those parties. The parties I went to were held by JWs who knew me by sight.

It is easy enough to fake those cards anyway. After all we have scans of them on JWD now. It's like providing info for the active JW DBs; like they are going to call the PO in those congregations and say they are checking up on someone for a DB that the WTS has "forbidden."

If you are an "active" JW and get a card filled out and don't carry it with you, be aware that if you are injured and are unconscious, that your spouse or legal guardian can make medical decisions for you without having that card. The only way that can be overridden is to have a healthcare power of attorney designating someone else (and it will be a big surprise to the spouse/legal guardian).

My experience is that many JWs are lax in filling out and signing these documents. The local no-blood clinic has said they will cooperate with JWs but want them to file a HC-POA some time before they need treatment. After a seminar with over 100 local elders and other poobahs, only 1 was filed....hmmm what does that say?

Blondie

YoursChelbie

What is he going to do, grab your wallet or purse and look through it. I'd hit him up side the head.

The blood card scanned states that whoever signs it agrees there is "no fraud." However
the card itself has contradictions: It lists "hemodiluiton" as an optional procedure. (by definition it ANH invoves taking blood out, storing it in the operating room while the patient is being operated on, then infusing it back into the patient.) But if you read the top portion of the card it says the person is, by signing, refusing to PREDONATE his/her own blood.

You are still getting it back.

This procedure ANH was done on patients who are identified as JW in this report:

Transfusion Free Surgery: Single Institution Experience of 27 Consecutive Liver Transplants in Jehovah's Witnesses. Jabbour N, Gagandeep S, Mateo R, Sher L, Genyk Y, Selby R. J Am Coll Surg. 2005 Sep;201(3):412-7. The Division of Hepatobiliary/Pancreatic Surgery and Transplantation Surgery, University of Southern California-University Hospital and Keck School of Medicine, Los Angeles, CA.
BACKGROUND: Despite the risks associated with transfusion, the medical community continues to view blood as a safe and abundant product. In this article, we provide an effective strategy to accomplish orthotopic liver transplantation without transfusion. STUDY DESIGN: From June 1999 through July 2004, 27 liver transplantations were performed in Jehovah's Witness patients at the USC-University Hospital (24 adults, 3 children). Nineteen of these were living donor (LD) and eight were deceased donor (DD) liver transplants. Preoperative blood augmentation with erythropoietin and iron was achieved. At induction, all LD and six of eight DD recipients underwent acute normovolemic hemodilution (ANH), and the operation was conducted under conditions of moderate anemia.

From: http://sabm.org/education/ezines/sabm_ezine_1005.pdf

YC

Re New Blood card, Statement of Witnesses

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