Research on the validity of 1914

by Bluegrass Tom 78 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  Bluegrass Tom

  Here are a few facts that I have recently discovered by doing some research.

  The Watchtower Society uses the date of 539 B.C.E as the date that Cyrus took over Babylon. they use the term "absolute date" to define this as an unquestionable point in time. I find that only the Watchtower uses the term "absolute date". No one else, scholars, historians, etc. use this term. At least that's what my research reveals.

  From the date of 539 B.C.E the Watchtower Society allows 2 years for the Jews to return to Jerusalem and start re-building the Temple. This brings us to 537 B.C.E. This is okay. Then they apply the 70 years of desolation mentioned in Jeremiah and arrive at the date of 607 B.C.E as the date that Jerusalem was destroyed by the Babylonians. From 607 B.C.E they count the 2,520 years (prophecy) and get to 1914. They count back from 539 B.C.E to a point in time, and then go forward from that point to get to 1914.

  The problem here is that although history agrees with the 539 B.C.E date, history fixes the destruction of Jerusalem as 586 B.C.E, not 607. Every encyclopedia, textbook, scholar, historian and University I could find all agree on and use the date of 586 B.C.E as the date for the destruction of Jerusalem not 607. Only the Watchtower uses the 607 date.

  From this I have concluded that the date of 607 is not the real date for the destruction of Jerusalem but one that only fits with the seventy years prophecy. Jerusalem never lay "desolated" for 70 years. It was only desolate from 537 to 586. That is 49 years. I seem to think that the watchtower used only the 539 date and ignored the 586 date because it didn't fit with what they wanted; the 70 years, the 2,520 years and 1914. 1914 was the goal, and they backed-into the dates to make them work. To do this they had to ignore 586 B.C.E which is the real date for the destruction of Jerusalem.

  Therefore, if Jerusalem never lay desolate for 70 years, when does this desolation and fulfillment of this prophecy take place? When does the 2,520 years start? 1914 can't be correct. 1914 is based on 607, and 607 is only mathematical, not actual. 586 is the real date.
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  undercover

  HI HO Silver, Away!

  Welcome to the freedom of independant research and thinking. You have systematically and methodically shot down the WTS claims of the end time prophecies and gentile times ending in 1914. Good job. Now if you wanna really see something go way back and read the early Watchtowers under Russells regime. Dates that most JWs today never heard of will be very prominent, 1874, 1881 and the destruction of the wicked in 1914.

  As for your questions about the 70 year desolation and the 2520 years, I don't know. Once I realized that the WTS was wrong, I gave up caring about apocolyptic meanderings from adventist relgions and crackpot religious leaders.
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  zen nudist

  Therefore, if Jerusalem never lay desolate for 70 years, when does this desolation and fulfillment of this prophecy take place? When does the 2,520 years start? 1914 can't be correct. 1914 is based on 607, and 607 is only mathematical, not actual. 586 is the real date.

  what 2520 years? the WT made this up out of thin air, there is absolutely nothing anywhere in the bible that gives this figure.

  JWs invented this from a warped and twisted reading of a prophecy which is explained by the bible relating ONLY to the king of babylon and not to anyone or anything else.... a bit of poetic license on JWs part to fit an already existing pyramid calculation which happened to be 40 years from Jesus invisible return in 1874... back then when Russell first dreamed up this fantasy prophetic calculation, they had three different methods which all PROVED beyond a shadow of a doubt that the world would END in 1914 and Jesus would BEGIN ruling the world as the Gentile times would thus be over.

  guess what..... it was all delusional fantasizing of a man who thought himself a prophet of God.... believing he had all the correct answers and all the churches of the world needed to come to him to learn.... most of his stuff is now considered apostate material still taught by some of his true followers the millenial dawn bible students and a host of other splinter groups who emerged after Rutherford Stormed the tower.
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  ellderwho

  Bluegrass Tom,

  Welcome to the forum. 607 is very problematic for the Jw. Any Jw who is sincere about neo-Babylonian rule and who ruled when, will come to the conclusion that 607 is merely smoke and mirror for 1914... period.
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  amused

  Bluegrass.....forget the 2,520 years. Look at the prophecy in Jeremiah and it plainly states that the 70 years were years of servitude to Babylon, not 70 years of desolation. Judah was servant to Babylon long before the temple was destroyed.

  For a more detailed study of this topic, read Carl Olof Jonsson's book, The Gentile Times Reconsidered.
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  Neo

  Another newbie!!

  Amused, welcome aboard!!

  Regarding 607 issues, we need our own little resident scholar, Neil. Where are you, boy? Celebrating New Year's Eve?? Will you bite this thread and run away again after a few posts?

  Neo
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  scholar

  Bluegrass Tom

  Your research is sloppy and misguided. For starters, the Society is by no means alone in the use of the term 'Absolute Dates' for the purposes of chronology. Christendom's most eminent chronolgist the SDA Edwin Thiele titled one of his chapters in his Mysterious Numbers Of The Hebrew Kings', 'Absolute Date for the Old Testament'..

  Scholars are divided as to whether 586 or 587 should be the calender year for the Fall of Jerusalem and your research should have shown this discrepancy. In my view, the majority opinion within scholarship leans towards 586 rather than 587 which does not concur with the Jonsson hypothesis. The Society's date of 607 is the only possible candidate as I have repeatedly argued as it is in harmony with biblical, historical and secular evidence. Such an established date provides a sound basis for calculating the prophetic year of 1914.

  scholar

  BA MA Studies in Religion
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  onacruse

  Hello BT, and welcome to JWD.

  fwiw, ignore "scholar," who has been exorciated so many times on this db (and others) that it's hard to imagine how he has survived (read "keeps coming back like a pox").

  Craig
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  justhuman

  Wellcome to the REAL WORLD
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  City Fan

  Hooray!!!!!!!!!! Scholar is back.

  Happy New Year Scholar, BA MA Studies in Repetition ad Nauseum.

  The Society's date of 607 is the only possible candidate as I have repeatedly argued as it is in harmony with biblical, historical and secular evidence

  Once again, please name one piece of secular evidence in favour of 607 BCE.

  CF.