Damien

Nathan Natas

I tried to reply to Damien's post, but kept getting an error. I hope he sees this.

The information you want is for the case of Douglas Walsh v. The Right Honorable James Latham Clyde, M.P., P.C., etc., Scotland, 1954, usually called "the Walsh trial."

This trial has been discussed here in the past, but limitations of the search facility make it well nigh impossible to find them. On the web you can find excerpts from the trial, but I suspect you'd like to get the whole enchilada. A couple of years ago I saw a website where someone was selling the transcript in its entirety - not cheap. Even less cheap would be a copy purchased from the Scottish courts - I think they offer both paper copies ($$$) and microfilm($).

Someday, perhaps, someone will digitize the entire document and distribute it on CDROM. Until then...

You might contact the appropriate (Scottish? British?) consulate and ask how you might obtain an official copy, if that is what you want.

Thank you very much. Unfortunately that is the response I expected. It's a shame, that documentation alone would be invaluable in speaking with a current witness, though they probably wouldn't look at it. Thanks again

Nathan Natas

I've just spent a while trying to dislodge the information that was stuck in a crevice of my brain, and I think I've got some information for you:

A copy of the case can be obtained from The National Archives of Scotland in Edinburgh.

The case is called

"Douglas Walsh vs. The Right Honorable James Latham Clyde, M.P., P.C., representing the Ministry of Labour and National Service -- Scottish Court of Sessions, Cs 258/2788, November 1954".

Contact info:
The National Archives of Scotland (formerly the Scottish Record Office)
HM General Register House,
Edinburgh EH1 3YY
Scotland

TELEPHONE: +44-131-535-1314.
TELEFAX: +44-131-535-1360.
Web pages: http://www.nas.gov.uk/

I have already taken the liberty of contacting them and requesting information about the availability of the transcripts and their associated costs. I plan to pay with your credit card. :)

If and when I hear from them, I'll post a follow up in this thread.

garybuss

I got a copy from

WITNESS INC.
P.O. BOX 597
CLAYTON, CA 94517 USA
PHONE (925)672-5979
FAX:(925)672-8230

several years ago. I bet Duane can get you a copy.

Damien

hahahahaha...... Thank you both very much. Laughing about the credit card comment nathan (wouldn't be a problem, it was just funny). Yes thank you both very much I am kind of anxious to see the whole thing myself although probably the most interesting parts have already been posted elsewhere. I just would like to have it all in one piece. Thank you two very much

Earnest

Further to the information that NN provided, I understand you can obtain a copy from :

Scottish Records Office, PO Box 36, HM General Office, Edinburgh, EH1 3YY.
Ref: Persur's Proof C5258/1958/2738

According to the post from which I got this information (June 6, 2002) a microfiche copy is £35-40, a photocopy £180.00.

Nathan Natas

I GOT A REPLY!! WOO-HOO!!!

Dear XXXXXXXXXXXX,

Douglas Walsh v The Right Honourable James Latham Clyde

Thank you for your e-mail of 7th October 2003 concerning the Court of Session case Douglas Walsh v the Right Honourable James Latham Clyde, MP, PC as Minister of Labour and National Service (ref: CS258/1958/2738).

In this case Mr. Walsh wished the court to find the Jehovah's Witnesses to be a religious denomination for the purposes of the National Services Act, 1948, and that he be found to be a regular minister of that denomination thereby exempting him from National Service. Lord Strachan found that the Jehovah's Witnesses were a religious denomination but did not find the pursuer a regular minister. Lords Patrick and Mackintosh and the Lord Justice Clerk concurred with his findings.

The complete case papers number 1186 pages and include procedural papers (inventory, summons, interlocutors, motion sheet, minutes, defences, closed record, etc) (106 pages), the Opinions of Lords Strachan, Mackintosh, Patrick and the Lord Justice Clerk (109 pages), the Pursuer's Proof (815
pages) and the Closing Speeches by Senior Counsel, the Dean of Faculty and Mr. Leslie (156 pages). It is the Pursuer's Proof, in which is detailed the operations and beliefs of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society and the Jehovah's Witnesses, that has been of particular interest to previous
enquirers. In the course of the Pursuer's Proof evidence was given by Hayden Covington, legal adviser to the Jehovah's Witnesses, Frederick Franz, Vice President of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society and Grant Suiter, Secretary and treasurer of the Pennsylvania Corporation and New York
Incorporation of Jehovah's Witnesses.

We can supply you with xerox or microfilm copies of the whole or any part of these papers. A special package microfilm of the Pursuer's Proof is available at a less expensive rate as a negative copy is already available. You will find a list of current prices appended.

The cost includes airmail postage, packing, and a handling charge. If you decide to proceed with an order, please send a crossed cheque, drawn on a British account, or international money order, in sterling, made out in favour of the 'National Archives of Scotland'. Payment must be made in
advance.

We are also able to accept payment by the following credit cards and debit cards: Visa, MasterCard, Switch and Solo. In order to make a payment by credit/debit card you must provide us with: 1) the card number; 2) the card expiry date; 3) the issue number if Switch; 4) the cardholder's name and
initials as shown on the card; and 5) the cardholder's address, not the delivery address. Please note that all of these details are essential, and can be e-mailed to [email protected]
However, because we do not have an encryption programme to protect incoming e-mail, and details sent via e-mail are not secure you may prefer to send any credit card details by post. Alternatively, you may wish to telephone Linda Stuart with your payment details on 00 44 131 535 1383.

We shall proceed with your order on receipt of payment. This estimate is valid for two months only, from the date of this e-mail. We regret that we do not accept payment in currencies other than sterling. Please note that we will require a postal address to send your order to on completion.

If you do decide to proceed with this order, please also note that it will take at least 3 to 4 weeks to process once we have received payment from you as the order will be sent to the National Archives of Scotland's Reprographic Branch.

CS258/1958/2738 Walsh v Minister of Labour and National Service

Estimated Price List: October 2003

Standard Service (Air)

1. Xerox

a. Complete copy (1186 pages) £600.00 ($995.70 US)

b. Pursuer's proof (815 pages) £415.00 ($688.69 US)

2. Microfilm

a. Complete copy or Pursuer's proof £40.00 ($66.38 US)

Please note that all charges are in sterling, and that all remittances should be made in STERLING.

I hope that this information will prove useful to you, I wish you ever success with your research.

Yours sincerely,

Tessa Spencer
West Search Room Archivist

THE NATIONAL ARCHIVES OF SCOTLAND
West Register House
Charlotte Square
Edinburgh
EH2 4DF

E-mail: [email protected]
Website: http://www.nas.gov.uk
Tel: 0131 535 1314 Direct line: 0131 535 1413
Fax: 0131 535 1411

CrossReach

Hi Damien,

The Manuscript can be downloaded free of charge here;

http://www.lulu.com/content/762879

God bless

Damien - The Scotland Trial

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