The Present Truth is the Truth and the Old Truth is the Truth, even if they contradict.

by garyneal 38 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • garyneal
    garyneal

    That is the conclusion you must accept if you are a Jehovah's Witness as my wife tries to explain to me that even if what they are teaching today contradicts what they were previously teaching, they had the truth then and they have the truth now. The difference is, they (the witnesses and the governing body) simply BELIEVED that what they were teaching at the time was the TRUTH but when they discovered new information they adjusted their thinking. SO since they formerly believed it to be the truth, they were in the truth.

    An example she gave involved people who once believed the earth was flat. Was what they believed true? It was true as far as they can tell, therefore it was true. Now that we know the earth was round, they were still believing in things that were true simply because they did not know any better. After all, encyclopedias that I consult for 'accurate information' are only true as far as the limits of human knowledge. So they are PRESENTLY true.

    This kind of nonsense double talk is like nails to a chalkboard to me. The people who believed the earth was flat were not believing truth as the earth was not flat and their believing so does not make it so. If someone believed something to be true and later found evidence that contradicts that belief would be honest by simply saying, "I thought it was true, but I was wrong." That's the whole failure of the Watchtower's Governing Body when they hide behind concepts like 'new light' and 'progressive truth' to justify their doctrinal changes, they never want to admit that they are wrong.

    Yet, my wife claims that the Watchtower never proclaimed that what they were teaching is TRUTH even though witnesses use phrases like, "Are you in the truth?" Instead, they are simply seeking truth unlike OTHER churches that wish to wallow in their own ignorance because they LIKE certain teachings even if they are false. I mean, nevermind the stubborness they show by holding onto 1914 CE and 607 BCE when not a single source outside the WT supports those dates due to pesky things like EVIDENCE.

    In the end, when she has no more wiggle room to justify her answers she resorts to threats (be careful about how you talk about God), character assassination, and simply saying things like "one day you'll get it if only you allow yourself too." This same maneuvering I've seen in other theists (mainly Christians) when confronting atheists have caused me to call them out for being dishonest as well. It's like nails to a chalkboard for me.

  • OneEyedJoe
    OneEyedJoe

    There was an elder in my congregation (who, sadly passed away before I learned TTATT, so I can't be 100% sure on this) that I think MUST have been awake to TTATT because of, among other things, a talk he once gave on this very topic. He made it sound so outlandish (at least to me, even while I was still indoctrinated) that I now think he was trying to wake people up. He brought up a lot of the contradictions over the years and insisted that the previous belief and the current one were both true, even though only the current one is true. That was the last talk he gave before he stepped down as an elder, citing his health.

    He was a voracious reader and a genuinely intelligent man, if a bit stubborn. Another elder once told me that "he was almost appostate" and apparently he went through a period where he was very "down on the organization." I think he had an awakening about 10 years back, but stayed in because he was dependant (poor health and old age) on family. He could always be counted on to contradict the WT in his coments any time it started to take too much of a hard-line stance on anything.

  • clarity
    clarity

    Good subject.......that must be the reason

    most dubs can ignore the obvious!

    Your wife may have point ........but they are

    talking here about "god directing" them.

    GOD! Why cannot god get it right the first

    time!

    *

    They make their god out to be an idiot!

    He just can't get it right.

    *

    Or he just hasn't got the time and says

    "hey you princes & dukes ...look just tell

    them ...hmmm well just tell them no

    blood transfusions or I'll kill them for it!

    Yes yes Thousands of babies & new moms

    & everybody else with great blood loss will

    die of course ........but hey that will make

    ME HAPPY! If I can think up something else

    later .......hey, I will let you know ....well

    if & when I have time! signing off now, GOD.

    clarity

    .

  • One Last Kiss
    One Last Kiss

    Nails down a chalkboard is the perfect description!!

    Every member of every other religion firmly believes that what they know is true, so by your wife's reasoning it IS true and therefore Jehovah can have no beef with them. Ergo: she needs never go out in field ministry again, huzah!

  • Theredeemer
    Theredeemer

    "You know why we say "I always thought it was this way anyway" when we are presented with new light or new understanding? It is because the truth is within true christians. Through holy spirit Jehovah has givin us the truth. We have had it the moment we wholeheartedly dedicated ourselves to him. However, he slowly makes the truth shine brighter as to not overwhelm us or stuble us. But when he does show us the brighter light, we realize it was always there, it just needed to be made brighter. That is why you here, "I always felt that way.""

    This is what a former CO missionary, who is a family friend, explained new light to me after finding out I had left and had questions over things. This was the last 'question' he answered. After a long pause I responded "That is probably the most idiotic fantasy thing I have ever heard in my entire life! Did you just make that up right now or is this the kind of bull they teach you to spew out in Gilead School?! And you wonder why your no longer a CO".

    Kind of harsh but I felt like he thought I was stupid to tell me this. Never spoke to him again.

  • Crazyguy
    Crazyguy

    Then tell your wife that if this is the case they and her need to stop saying bad things about all other Christian religions but what they teach they think is true at this time. She must also stop criticizing you or any apostates because in their minds they have the truth and maybe just got it sooner then the organization. Bring up Romans chapter 14 where Paul pretty much says this and then ask her why the Borg doesn't follow along with Paul.

  • Ucantnome
    Ucantnome

    this is my view (it could be wrong)

    some years ago we had what we called the 'truth' book In th first chapter it quotes John 17:3.

    Jesus said i am the way and the truth

    the gospel is about Jesus. (1cor.15:1-4) and if the anointed witnesses are the body of Christ and they preach the right gospel of the kingdom then they are in the 'truth' irrespective of what things have been taught at times.

  • Heaven
    Heaven

    The Present Truth is the Truth and the Old Truth is the Truth, even if they contradict.

    Bull Shiite! The above statement is intellectually dishonest... and rather insane.

    Crazy Emoticon

  • Ucantnome
    Ucantnome

    'the entire body of Christian teachings, which became part of the written Word of God is "the truth" or "the truth of the good news" Adherence to this truth, walking in it, is essential if an individual is to gain salvation.'

    Insight on the scriptures (WT 1988) page 1132

    Just thought i would add this to my post

  • Heaven
    Heaven

    If Matthew 10:35 is truth, I want nothing to do with it.

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