"Theocratic Warfare" and the Annual Report

by Billy the Ex-Bethelite 141 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  GLTirebiter

  Well, I also think the reports of increase are coming from countries that are more likely to use "theocratic warfare strategy" and fatten up their reports to satisfy Brooklyn and keep their branches open.

  This account sounds a lot like what happens in big business when the belt-tightening gets intense. Executives who want to protect their divisions and regional offices will tell the Big Boss whatever he wants to hear, and keep up appearances to convince the big-wigs that it's true. If you want favorable reports, we can write them for you!

  It tells you what is important to the leaders. The GB surely knows that time reports are exaggerated, but they have no problem repeating that bogus data. Conclusion: "preaching work" really isn't the huge priority they say it is.

  Who's going to check their figures?

  Field service numbers? Probably nobody. But the branch's financial figures are another story!
• 

  Quarterback

  And the Head of the Attendants, went on to say, " These numbers just won't do. Count again, this time count every baby, every fly, every bug, go into the womans wash room look under the door, count every leg, look in the corridor, count every slacker, count yourself, count , count , count"
• 

  neverendingjourney

  Most of us (if not all) have stories that could back this up. The congregation secretary at my old Hall was a disaster as far as organization went, and his wife was one of the biggest gossips in the circuit. He used to leave the elder's book out in plain sight in his house and you'd often find publisher cards under the seat cushions. He also had five small kids. His wife seemed to know the intimate details of judicial committe matters going back many years, but that's another story.

  Not long after my baptism, he not surprisingly lost a boat load of publisher cards. He started houding the brothers for the slips they had already turned in because the CO visit was drawing near. He asked my Mom and she told him that she no longer had records going back that far. He point blank told her in front of me to give him a number, any number. Estimate it, he said. My jaw hit the floor. This was back when I was all in and thought it was actually a rosy spiritual paradise such as is portrayed in the literature.

  A year or so later I became a regular pioneer and was out in service with the service overseer (also a pioneer). We were out for about an hour and fifteen minutes. I kept meticulous records at the time (although with the passage of time I too fudged my numbers) and when he saw me write down 1:15 in my notebook he said to me, "Write down 3 hours. We're pioneers, after all." It suddenly made sense how we was able to work a job that often required overtime, be an elder and pioneer all at the same time.

  It's part of the culture. You may not start out that way, but most eventually become that way. The numbers are fudged from top to bottom.
• 

  ziddina

  Hooooooooolllleeeeyyyyyyy Hannah...

  I thought I'd reached the point where NOTHING that the Watchtower Corporation pulled, would surprise me...

  It makes sense, once you've pulled the curtain aside, Billy. Funny that I never quite thought about it....

  Wowwwwieeeee....

  Yes, that makes it MUCH more likely that the Watchtower is bleeding out far faster than we realize...
• 

  factfinder

  One thing that some of you have in common-you were dishonest in your reports and you are no longer witnesses. So how faithful were you as witnesses?

  An elder who was studying with me (I had become discouraged) was the cong secreatary. So...I found out from him a lot about what was going on in our cong. A big problem: a lot of publishers WERE NOT REPORTING THEIR FS. I worked with numerous brothers and sisters and helped the secretary organize the record cards and told him: I worked with that sister last saturday. We were out door to door for two hours. But she did not hand in a time slip. I worked with some brothers who did not hand in time slips. I told the elder they DID go out! I worked with them.

  I would hear him complain to me too many are not reporting fs. I TOLD him about the ones I worked with. He told me unless each publisher reports their time he can not put anything down for them. I spoke to some about it and heard "Why does it matter? Jehovah knows what we are doing?"

  The elder was upset by this. There was even a local needs part at our hall and at the Circuit Assembly about the need to report fs.

  So here we have posters saying they faked fs time for themselves and others and faked meeting attendence reports.

  What planet are you all from? I'm from NJ and my experiences are exactly the opposite of yours!

  I don't know if I should believe these posts or not because you lied as witnesses? Whose to say you are not just making this up now?

  I am really surprised by the dishonesty. I can't believe you were REALLY Jehovah's Witnesses!

  Even if its true some do fake their reports (fake witnesses they are!) there are many more who go out in FS and DON"T get counted.

  I can't believe this. I'm starting to believe my brother is right after all.

  Anyway- there was a year that the US Report showed a spike in publishers. It jumped from 980,000 to 1,040,000-an increase of 60,000! But the next year? It was 988,000. Very disappointing. Where did all those publishers go? i have no idea! It never increased like that again.

  This past decade the US has had several years with 0% growth, and in the last few years 1-4%.

  But posters saying they just made up figures WHILE THEY WERE witnesses, even cong secrtary?

  Well, I was a witness about 30 years. I was in 6 different congs. There was a problem with publishers not reporting in each one. And thus they were not counted. I remember several CO's mentioning how important it is to report. I saw publisher counts go down when he'd tell us the summery for the last 6 months in our cong. Very discouraging. But it was being honest.
• 

  JW GoneBad

  The expression'Do The Math' is a fallacy with repect to the WTBTS and its' collection of statistics!

  The phrase 'Numbers Don't Lie' as well cannot be used to add authenticity to their figures.

  The numbers of the WTBTS cannot be relied upon for accuracy. The fact is their numbers are indeed greatly inflated.

  For example the 1,557,788,344 total hours that is claimed was spent in field service during the 2010 service year is abundantly exaggerated by the publishers and the leadership know it. One half of that time was spent at a 'coffee shop' alone. Then you add the idle chat time that is spent after meeting for field service. We are lucky if the first door we knock at is 10:15 a.m. and that is with field service starting at 9:00 a.m. Meeting for F/S is meant to last 15 to 20 minutes and out the door! So when we end field service, at say 11:30 or 12:00 noon we have really only spent at best 1 hour in the actual door to door activity.

  True is the Proverb: "There are six things that Jehovah does hate; yes, seven are things detestable to his soul: .........a false tongue" (Prov 6:16)

  Bottom line: The Annual Report is a false report put out by the WTBTS and they know it!

  Factfinder: In my experience those down playing their actual time in F/S were and have been a minority. Yeah, I may have been a party to these inflated and false reports but I'm not loosing sleep over it. The collection of most of these numbers is nonsense!
• 

  Gayle

  Bottomline, any arrangement of "counting time" in any which way, in doing any "good" thing or a right thing is going counter to what is right. Period.
• 

  factfinder

  It is very dissapointing to me and surprising that many claim they faked their fs reports.

  I am going through so many conflicting feelings and ideas- I don't know who to believe.

  I find out about wrongdoing on the part of the wts (the UN/NGO thing), the failed prophesies, the ridiculous nonsense that Russell and Rutherford taught (I had never been interested in much about what was taught back then while I was a witness), And realize, well, the truth about the truth. Still, I have doubts-both ways. I had doubts as a witness, and I have doubts now.

  I discovered jwn and found many who had similar discouraging experiences in the cong as I had. I felt many who post here spoke from firsthand experience and I appreciate much of the info I have discovered from people posting on this website.

  But in this thread and in others I keep reading about how people were dishonest even while they were witnesses, some being pioneers and elders, bethelites and cong secretary. And I wonder-how honest are these people? If they saw nothing wrong with lying while they were witnesses, how honest would they be now?

  My brother cut off contact with me a year ago July. Do you know why? Because I don't return to the kh and I come to this forum. I tried sharing info I disvovered on this forum with him. result: He said I am "the mouthpiece of satan" and now he won't listen to anything I say.

  He had told me in past conversations that "apostates" are dishonest and lie about the witnesses and pretend to be elders, pioneers etc.

  Now I am wondering? Is there some truth in what he says? I do not know anyone personally on this site. I have been accepting what people say about themselves-why would they lie? What would be the point?

  But if you lied WHILE you were one of Jehovah's Witnesses, and justify it, how can I know you are not lying in your posts just to push people away from the witnesses?

  It is really discouraging me. I'm trying to be objective and balenced, but now I question the motives of many posters. Do they have a personal vendetta against the wts and would say anything to paint the wts in a bad light? Who should I believe?

  Am I alone in feeling this way?. No one else seems bothered by the dishonesty. Jehovah's Witnesses are taught to be honest in ALL things. I am far from perfect but I really tried to be 100% honest and tried to be as accurate as possible in my fs reports. Now I'm being told I was in the miinority? That does not sound right!

  And anyway" about the fs hours published as 1.5 billion. Even if its just half that-its a lot of time preaching!
• 

  JW GoneBad

  Factfinder: about the fs hours published as 1.5 billion. Even if its just half that-its a lot of time preaching!

  It is a misrepresentation, blown out of proportion, a padded number by the so called 'Faithful and Discreet Slave'.

  1/2 of 1.5 billion is generous. I know of car groups of up to 7 adult publishers making RVs on a given morning, with only 1 maybe 2 calls being made on persons who would rather you not come by anymore or are not at home. Some publishers never get out of the vehicle the whole morning. Yet up to 14 hours maybe more are counted. It is like Gayle says....

  "any arrangement of "counting time" in any which way, in doing any "good" thing or a right thing is going counter to what is right." Soo True!

  It is find well and good that someone would go out of his way and spend say, Saturday or Sunday morning to talk to someone about the Bible and God. But what is the motivating factor? In a word ....................RECOGNITION! You are not going to climb the ladder of JW World being a less than average hour publisher.

  A less than average hour publisher is considered a weakling, a misfit! SAD!

  Factfinder, if you've been in the 'Truth' for any length of time you know the above is fact!

  So what do you do? The JW system of counting time forces you to fudge your numbers. Why? To make you look good. We all want to look good.
• 

  factfinder

  JW GoneBad-

  I did not want to climb any ladder! I was not interested in getting a title. I began in fs in Nov.1976 and sent in my last fs report in Aug 2006 or 2007.

  I was not interested in recognition. I went out in fs because I was taught Jehovah wanted me to. When I didn't want to go out, I didn't.

  On some days I wanted to work with certain ones so I could hang out with them, so on certain days the only reason I went out that day was to work with a certain brother or sister.

  I had no interest in gaining a position -ms or elder. I helped a lot in the cong. but with no title and that was fine with me. I hate titles and I have no interest in trying to be above other people.

  I can see now from many posts that a lot of people posting here became (or were) witnesses for different reasons than I did and went in fs for different reasons. Thus I can see why you did not remain a witness.

  Again- I feel like an outsider here on jwn just as I did in the cong.