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stevenycDeny this! Brooklyn! I dare you


I'm to angry right now to write a complete synopsis on the following article from the watchtower. It regarding child molestation and repressed memories. I'll put in one quote, and leave this rest for you to read at your leasure.

ps, probably worth copying this because I would be surprised if they will leave it up much longer!

steve

What if the sufferer decides that he wants to make an accusation?# Then the two elders can advise him that, in line with the principle at Matthew 18:15, he should personally approach the accused about the matter. If the accuser is not emotionally able to do this face-to-face, it can be done by telephone or perhaps by writing a letter. In this way the one accused is given the opportunity to go on record before Jehovah with his answer to the accusation. He may even be able to present evidence that he could not have committed the abuse. Or perhaps the one accused will confess, and a reconciliation may be achieved. What a blessing that would be! If there is a confession, the two elders can handle matters further in accordance with Scriptural principles.

If the accusation is denied, the elders should explain to the accuser that nothing more can be done in a judicial way. And the congregation will continue to view the one accused as an innocent person. The Bible says that there must be two or three witnesses before judicial action can be taken. (2 Corinthians 13:1; 1 Timothy 5:19) Even if more than one person "remembers" abuse by the same individual, the nature of these recalls is just too uncertain to base judicial decisions on them without other supporting evidence. This does not mean that such "memories" are viewed as false (or that they are viewed as true). But Bible principles must be followed in establishing a matter judicially.

What if the one accused—though denying the wrongdoing—is really guilty? Does he "get away with it," as it were? Certainly not! The question of his guilt or innocence can be safely left in Jehovah's hands. "The sins of some men are publicly manifest, leading directly to judgment, but as for other men their sins also become manifest later." (1 Timothy 5:24; Romans 12:19; 14:12) The book of Proverbs says: "The expectation of the righteous ones is a rejoicing, but the very hope of the wicked ones will perish." "When a wicked man dies, his hope perishes." (Proverbs 10:28; 11:7) Ultimately, Jehovah God and Christ Jesus render everlasting judgment in justice.—1 Corinthians 4:5.

 

steve

http://www.watchtower.org/library/w/1995/11/1a/article_01.htm

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klsRe: Deny this! Brooklyn! I dare you
After reading this and that F***ing PBS show that is to air ,i am just livid Sick ,Sick and we can do nothing to stop any of this.
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cruzanheartRe: Deny this! Brooklyn! I dare you

  Disgusting.

Nina
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doofdaddyRe: Deny this! Brooklyn! I dare you

Steve,

were we ever part of that crazy organisation???

Shame, shame
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stevenycRe: Deny this! Brooklyn! I dare you

The final statement is a GEM !!!!!
 It may also be necessary for the step outlined in this paragraph to be taken if the matter has become common knowledge in the congregation

steve
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doofdaddyRe: Deny this! Brooklyn! I dare you
You gotta wonder if there had been allegations against members of the gb if those sorts of warped statements were made. It so sounds like a cover up. Am I reading too much into this??
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sonnyboyRe: Deny this! Brooklyn! I dare you

I think the FBI needs to take a look at the f*cking cult.

So, unless a JW grabs a kid's crotch in front of two or three other people, he didn't do it? Then they silence the kid and act like the pedophile is innocent?

They're supporting pedophilia, plain and simple. More can be done to find out what's going on than having two or three witnesses around. We have a little something that wasn't available when the Bible was written...technology anyone? DNA analysis? Video cameras? A more thorough judicial process?

What a bunch of f*cking psychos. I hate the GB with a passion.

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zen nudist  Re: Deny this! Brooklyn! I dare you

if someone has faith in a fantasy god, they have the legal right in the USof A and many other countries to be abused under their religious beliefs until they realize for themselves that their god does not exist and its time to call real authories and have their abusers locked up.

trying to force them to accept that their god is only a mirage will likely not help.
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GillRe: Deny this! Brooklyn! I dare you

What a tragedy!  These dumb asses are still not recommending going to the police.

Surely these kinds of statements prove the point when a person goes to the police and to court to claim that the elders knew they were being abused and did nothing to prevent it.  It shows the elders are being directed by the Organization to recommend that NOTHING is done and no protection is offered.

Doesn't this then prove that the WTBTS is guilty of not helping to prevent child abuse after accusations have been made?  They can no longer claim that it was up to the individual elders to do nothing.

There must be a lawyer somewhere out there who can use this direction from the bOrg to prove how guilty they are of child abuse cover ups!
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GillRe: Deny this! Brooklyn! I dare you

Is someone printing this off and recording it for evidence?

Anyone?
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daystarRe: Deny this! Brooklyn! I dare you
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stevenycRe: Deny this! Brooklyn! I dare you
This mentality come straight out of a camel hurders tent. How likley is it that two seperate people approach the elders with, as they say, "memories" of child abuse by the same person? Just a coincidence? Yep, if there is no other supporting evidence, then the alledged abuser is to be treated as innocent.

This article is not talking about children that inform the elders. Its talking about adults that remember a person in the congregation abusing them as children. If two or more adults, seperatly notify the elders that 'brother upstanding' molested them as kids, the elders will perform a 'hands off' approach UNLESS the congregation becomes aware. If the congregation becomes aware, then: if no further evidence is obtained, and the molester denies his actions, they will say he is innocent, and the matter to be left in Jehovah's hands.

This is an interesting qualification of the 'two witness' rule. To have two seperate witnesses of abuse is not good enough for reproval. It must be two witnesses PER action of molestation.

With the rules specified in this watchtower, can anyone explaine to me how any Jehovah's Witness can defend the Watchtower's policy on reporting child molesters.

Here is the rule stated:

If no other supporting invidence of child molestation arises, even given that multiple incidents of child molestation have been reported seperatly to the body of elders, then no further action is to be taken. The accused is to remain in good light in the congregation.

steve





IP: WbXrA8rHgnFZPvPc by stevenyc: Correct formatting
by stevenyc: Correct formatting
GillRe: Deny this! Brooklyn! I dare you
But the direction to 'do nothing' in these circumstances come from Brooklyn.  They are responsible for advising the inaction.  They are the ones who can be sued!
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klsRe: Deny this! Brooklyn! I dare you

Well i can tell you what one jw has to say about it ,,,,"That is what the Bible tells us to do ,we go by the Bible and the only true religion to do so , if someone wants to report molesting to the police ,they are free to do so."

This is the shit i get from my jw husband and it makes my skin crawl.You have no idea how this turns my stomach and he knows there are some pedophiles ,but feels they are treated justly by some getting disfellowshipped.

 

 Need  puke bucket?
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gesproRe: Deny this! Brooklyn! I dare you

Is someone printing this off and recording it for evidence?

Anyone?
Yep! Made a PDF file and it's a replica of the that WT page.
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GillRe: Deny this! Brooklyn! I dare you
Excellent.  Now we find the clever lawyer.  This information must be of use, in that it shows the general attitude of the WTBTS to those who claim abuse.  It shows that THEY ARE directing doing nothing without 2 or three witnesses.
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lisavegas420Re: Deny this! Brooklyn! I dare you

Holy Cow...I keep thinking I'm reading this wrong.  But I'm not. 

Lisa
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Big TexRe: Deny this! Brooklyn! I dare you
If no other supporting invidence of child molestation arises, even given that multiple incidents of child molestation have been reported seperatly to the body of elders, then no further action is to be taken. The accused is to remain in good light in the congregation.

Y'all didn't know this?  This is nothing new. 

I was told this in 1988.  And I'll even go ya one further.  I found two witnesses who were willing to testify to the elders (an aunt and my father's mother).  However I was told by the CO that they "didn't count" because they were worldly.  He said, "And after all, we all know how worldly people lie!"

I was told the rule above is correct with codicil that the elders will not take action unless there are two eyewitnesses and those two eyewitnesses must be baptized Jehovah's Witnesses preferably in good standing. 

Of course I was also told to "shut up" about my father or the CO would "see to it personally" I was DF'd.

This is nothing new, just standard old BS generated by the FDS.

 

Chris
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Big TexRe: Deny this! Brooklyn! I dare you
This is an interesting qualification of the 'two witness' rule. To have two seperate witnesses of abuse is not good enough for reproval. It must be two witnesses PER action of molestation.

Of course!  This 2 eyewitnesses are applied very literally.

Realize also that this means that the 2 eyewitnesses must stand and watch the child being raped, and cannot interfere or else there would be no child abuse (by the WTS standards).

Nice group of people.
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GillRe: Deny this! Brooklyn! I dare you
Can someone tell me then why this sort of attitude that is shown in WTBTS literature is not being used in cases in court that you have in the US where the WTBTS is denying responsibility for cover ups?
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