I agree, French...who cares about the disfellowshipping....it's the shunning that comes along with it that really affects people.

When the JW's start acting like human beings again, then I'll let up on them.

ashi

I too agree with disfellowshipping. I was always amazed at stories of people who lived a life of crime yet were still able to benefit from sacraments of the church. They should have been excommunicated because their life bore out that they had know real appreciation for Christian principles. The same goes for the witnesses, if a person openly goes against Bible teachings. However, many who have been disfellowshipped ie for adultery sincerely regret their actions but the mere fact they don't return to meetings is justification to ostracize them. Meeting attendance is no proof of repentance because many people live a double life. Also, some who leave don't do so to pursue an ungodly life , their love for God and his word are still strong and in some ways they have developed a closer bond with him.Just the mere fact they have lost faith in a man made organization is enough for the witnesses to consider them unfit association. I wonder if the shunning was ever abolished , if there would be a huge exodus from the org. as alienation from ones family and friends is more than some people could bear.

Frenchy,
I personally have a problem with the DF process. I have no problem with DA because a person chooses themselves to walk away. But to have your life decided by other people who are supposed to be reading if you are repentant. I just do not agree with this. How can they honestly know the difference? I don't feel it is our place to judge others.

Look how emotional people get when things happen that goes against their own conscience. Not one of us can say we objectively look at all things the same. I don't I have things that send me over the top. And I am not so quick to forgive those things, than I am others.

So I think the whole DF should be abolished. If the org continues to say that jehovah will sort everything out, and the bad apples will be weeded out. Why are they taking it upon themselves to d othe sorting?
wendy

Blind faith can justify anything.~Richard Dawkins

df'ing keeps whe crybabies out of the cong..

Frenchy,

I agree that if disfellowshipping meant "membership revoked," with no shunning involved, it would be quite a bit more palatable.

An active JW wandered into chat this past weekend and brought up the subject of disfellowshipping. This person wanted to see scriptural evidence that the JW practice is wrong. When I began reading up on this topic, I realized that it's not so much the basic premise that is flawed--both Jesus and Paul urged followers to distance themselves from unrepentant sinners--but the methods and rules that JWs use to regulate this procedure.

There are other questions, even with the simple scenario you describe. Who decides when a person's membership should be revoked? Is this a group decision, an individual decision, or a decision made by a secret committee of three elders? Who decides when a person is repentant?

Here's a link to the discussion we had after the active Jehovah's Witness appeared in chat:

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=15500&site=3

Ginny

nytelecom1 "Peeped":

Remarkable to note your general lack of humanity there nytelco. Tell me, should we string them up and boil them in oil now? Heaven forbid you have members of the "cong" with *GASP* actual PROBLEMS. Heaven forbid you to councel them and help them see past their weakness. Nah... "That would be what Jesus would have done, and hell, we have the governing body! WE DON'T NEED NO STINKING JESUS!"

boil in oil....nope....that would kill them...and we will
leave that to Jehovah when Armageddon time comes around...(not that
ALL df'd people will die at armageddon)

we always need jesus and why do you feel he stinks???

p.s..what the hell is peeped

detective, it's a sound thought, but also those people who were shunned and came back.....wouldn't they be enraged? What about the families who tortured their family members with shunning. Their guilt would be ridiculous. And people have killed themselves over bring disfellowshipped and such.....that's a heavy bruden of bloodguilt ont he org.

i wouldn't want to be in their shoes when it all hit the fan, which just shows why they'll never repeal their shunning edict.

ashi

I doubt they will ever change the policy on shunning. I'm sure they no how many would outright walk away, no longer quietly. They must know how many continue to fill the R&F who truly don't "believe" this is the right religion, but do not leave for fear of losing family and friends. Without this punishment, they would lose control. Without control, they would lose publishers. Without publishers, they would lose money. Without money.............

The dfing has to stay in place to control the masses and to keep them from leaving the org. It keeps them so scared of losing their eternal life that they put up with anything that is thrown at them. Think of it. What is there was no dfing? So many would leave because the threat of losing out on life would not be in place. Then what would the GB do about the dwindling masses? The dfing keeps them in power over the r and f. Overload them with field service, meetings, and studying so that they cannot think or respond and throw in the dfing and you have total control of people and their lives. Religion is the Opium of the People - Karl Marx.