This is the view as found in the latest magazine:

"For almost 2,000 years, that peace has been enjoyed by faithful anointed members of the body of Christ." (The Watchtower September 1, 2001, page 14, paragraph 3)

How good to see orthodox Christian belief in the magazine! This is also what Jesus promised: "And, look! I am with you all the days until the conclusion of the system of things." (Matthew 28:20)

Witnesses have long held that there was a period of spiritual dark ages ("The Great Apostasy") from the death of the apostles until the appearance of Russell's group of Bible Students toward the end of the nineteenth century.

A sea change? Or just another inconsistency?

Cheers,
Ozzie

"You can know the law by heart, without knowing the heart of it"
Philip Yancey, What's So Amazing About Grace?

Witnesses have long held that there was a period of spiritual dark ages ("The Great Apostasy") from the death of the apostles until the appearance of Russell's group of Bible Students toward the end of the nineteenth century.

now just "where" was "Jehovah's Organization" during all this time? And how were there 'anointed,' since there was no organization to "flock to?"

Peace!
Aaron

How do they know?

They go get theyselves a bag of runestones and throw them all away but two. One of these they name "Urim" the other they name "Thumin" unless they have Jewish ancestry. In that case, one of 'em is "Oy" the other one is "Vey". Anyway. These are filed down so they have six faces.

The rocks are then drilled with little holes, one hole on one face, two on another face, three on another, and so on until there are six faces with holes.

Then these rocks are thrown down a table lined with green felt. Usually the supplicant blows on the rocks. This is known as "breathing in the breath of life into their nostrils." Another part of the annointed vs loser ritual is to utter some imprecation at the rocks just at the moment of release. "Come on snake eyes" seems to be popular among the cognoscenti.

Depending on the result of adding the number of holes displayed on the two faces and comparing with a chart of increasing spirituality, the supplicant may have another throw of the sacred rune stones. A funny little guy wearing green eyeshades (to protect his peepers from the bright flash of spiritual illumination that invariably accompanies the correct combination of holes) and armed with a miniature garden hoe collects the di... sacred rune stones and pushes them back to the supplicant.

Sometimes the funny little guy is replaced by a comely damsel wearing an outfit, composed of less cotton than which can be found in the top of an aspirin bottle. This is doubtless to assist the supplicant get in the proper frame of mind ao as to receive the spirit direction so urgently sought.

Are you still with me?

When the proper combination of holes is displayed upon the sacred rune stones, if arrived at prior to a maximum number of attempts, the supplicant is awarded small round flat sacred stones which are then exchanged for smallish rectangles of greenish paper. When this is accomplished, the supplicant is said to be "in the spirit." With enough of these greenish paper rectangles, it is recognized by the WTBTS as indicating that you belong to the elect few, and you are ushered into membership in their sacred, secret traditions.

But you can't forget the sacred runes stones because the WTBTS uses this same process to determine the will of the creator of a vast universe of universes for his children who live on this dust spec.

When all this takes place, as it was forseen by the prophet, then the supplicant becomes, verilee, a certified card-carrying, Mogen David sipping, cracker-crunching member of the mote-loving, granny-tripping organization of Jehovah's Witnesses pig-dogs.

And there you have it.

Any questions?

Francois (at your service, I'm sure)

Where it is a duty to worship the Sun you can be sure that a study of the laws of heat is a crime.

WT 9/15/74 p 561
In spite of the fact that people live in such a world, this does not mean that the light from God and his Son, who is “the image of God,” and therefore is also light, is not reaching some among mankind and thus freeing them from the darkness. (John 8:12) The God of light and his Son have provided the light of truth to such an extent that throughout the history of mankind there have been some individuals who have walked in the light and have had the Creator’s favor and blessing. The eleventh chapter of Hebrews mentions a few of such individuals of pre-Christian times. The Christian Greek Scriptures relate the history of the beginnings of Christianity and carry us into the final days of the first century, telling about Christ Jesus and his followers, who walked in the light. And while we have little actual recorded history to identify the adherents of light in the centuries following the death of the apostles and early disciples of Christ down to our modern times, nevertheless, we are assured by the illustration of Jesus Christ concerning the wheat and the weeds that throughout that time there would be those walking in the light of God, following his Word, the Book of light. (Matt. 13:24-30, 36-43)

In days gone past I have heard of such groups as the Waldenses and the Lollards suggested as well as individuals such as Wycliffe and Luther and more recent Jonas Wendell and George Storrs. I am trying to find something in print.

Just reporting, Gopher, not supporting. I always thought it was reaching for something that wasn't there.

Again, not to belabor the issue, but as can be seen from the message below, it again is one persons inner feelings and the whole family of man as it were is to have the utmost confidence in his or her profound subliminal feelings that they somehow have been notified by the supreme being to be rulers with Christ in heaven. While in the apostles day such things were evident, case in point Christ proved himself to be the messiah by his fulfillment of prophesy, and miracles.
In pentecost there were flames of fire on the heads of those in the room, and so on.

IN REPLY TO:
The feeling is not vague:
Rom 8:15-17
15 For you did not receive a spirit that makes you a slave again to fear, but you received the spirit of sonship. And by him we cry, "Abba, Father." 16 The Spirit himself testifies with our spirit that we are God's children.

Gal 4:6-7
6 Because you are sons, God sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, the Spirit who calls out, "Abba, Father."

Mark 14:36
36 "Abba, Father," he said,

1 John 3:1-2
The reason the world does not know us is that it did not know him.

pomegranate

My point is with such a weighty responsibility for such a position as out line by the Witness's where is substantial evidence as a divine source, a reasonable man would see none, whereas even the non Christians inn Christ's time could see what was really from God.

OK "AS IF FIRE" Again the point is there is no manifestation that God Jehovah, or Jesus is with the 144000 to either make it plainly evident to them self's or to others, that they are who they claim to be. One would think such an important assignment as this would have some sort of backing to indicate some assurance that they are real, to them self's and more importantly to those who put such trust in them.
I guess that is why I have become so disillusioned with religion is that they make big boasts and put on such airs as to there righteousness and that they have Gods backing. In every instance I have ever read in the bible, or just plain horse sense dictates that proof should be evident. We truly are like puppets, or Borgs drones, believe it or die, do it or die, where is God in all of this?
Sorry folks, it gives me projectile vomituss the plain stupidity of it all. Shane

How glad we can be (tongue in cheek) that John Maynard Keynes fostered modern capitalism so that Jehovah could set up a corporation!

Cheers,
Ozzie

"You can know the law by heart, without knowing the heart of it"
Philip Yancey, What's So Amazing About Grace?

Gopher,

Remember, there was a peak of about 40,000 partakers in the 30's so the rest of centuries would have to settle on the other 100,000 or so and of course there are still 8,000, very few of whom were part of the 40,000 that were partakers in the 30's

have any of you ever noticed what big butt-heads the supposed anointed are? they are rude and self-important or the majority of them are anyway. i can't believe god would chose most of these people to lead his flock. i have really enjoyed reading your posts!