Prayers through the name of Jesus?

It's common practice for Dubs to end their prayers with words that indicate that they are being made "in Jesus' name" i.e. through the mediatorship of Jesus.

More than that, dubs listening to congregation prayers would be aghast if the prayer leader omitted the words "through Jesus Christ" as the concluding remark of his prayer.

How does this 'fit' with the official belief of the WTS concerning the role of Jesus as Mediator?

This is a teaching, of which many Dubs seem unaware. I can recall the look of disbelief when I brought this to the attention of Mrs Ozzie. "But I've always believed that Jesus was my Mediator!", she exclaimed. Yet it was in a Watchtower study article "Benefiting from "One Mediator Between God and Men"" (w79 11/15, page 24)

Later in the same study article the question on paragraph 25 reads:

To which the paragraph answers

This teaching was also discussed as a specific question in a Questions From Readers.(w79 4/1 page 31)

So does this logically mean that in congregations where there are NO claimants to anointed status, that the prayers should NOT be "in the name of Jesus"?

I can recall in recent times that a brother offering the prayer at the Service Meeting prayed "through our Mediator Jesus Christ". After the meeting he, too, was surprised to hear from me that as a member of the 'great crowd' Jesus is not his mediator.

Witnesses 'lurking' on this thread may also be surprised by this, and should read the references given in this and previous posts to verify that, indeed, the Watchtower teaches that, not Jesus, but the F&DS is their Mediator.

It's appropriate that this post should conclude with the Bible's words on the matter of the Mediator.

Cheers, Ozzie

Edited by - ozziepost on 18 November 2002 8:4:14

Ozzie,

Thanks for posting this.  I am calling my dad later today to ask him if he has ever considered it this way. 

Robyn

It should be unsettling for any JW to consider how this example of shoddy, self-serving "scholarship" so blithely treads on sacred ground, in effect putting the masses of JWs into the dilemma of having to deny Jesus Christ's mediation on their behalf or face expulsion.

        Doesn't it ever dawn on those knuckleheads that, as just one cursory glance of any dictionary will confirm, a given word can have several meanings, including a generic as well as specialized ones?   While "mediator' may well have a legal meaning, such as the case of resolving a dispute between two or more parties, it also has a generic meaning of "go-between"... it's a simple as that.

         Anyone who has heard a Spanish or Italian JW offer a prayer, it's generally ended with a statement that it is offered "mediante" Jesus, Gesu, or whatever.  Or is the hidden agenda, of reinforcing the unholy dichotomy of the primacy of so-called "anointed" over  the "other sheep" the real intent here? It's hard to conclude otherwise.

 

the bible was written for everyone. jesus belongs to who ever wants him and accepts him.

Ozzie,

Thank you for posting this. I had often wondered about this very subject. No one was ever able to explain it to my satisfaction.

CBeMe

 When I was a 'hovah, I was fully aware that Jesus was only the mediator for the anointed ones, yet I was OK with it. Somehow, it's OK for r&f 'hovahs to pray in Jesus name even if they understand the WTS's official teaching on the matter.

As long as 'hovahs understand the following WTS quote, it's OK for the r&f to pray saying that Jesus is "our" mediator:

More WTS twisted reasoning, inho.

TR

If Jesus is not our mediator (only for the 144,000) then how does the WTS explain the following quotes that depend on 1 Timothy 2:5 where Jesus is described as the only mediator in prayer between humans and God?  Based on this, only the remnant of the 144,000 here on earth can pray to God through Jesus.  Who do the other sheep pray through, the 144,000?

*** w97 2/15 28 Agreement Between "God's Temple" and Idols in Greece? ***
Furthermore, in a very clear way, the Scriptures rule out the idea of praying to "saints" in order for them to act as intercessors with God. In his model prayer, Jesus taught that prayers are to be addressed to the Father only, since he directed his disciples: "You must pray, then, this way: Our Father in the heavens, let your name be sanctified." (Matthew 6:9) Jesus further stated: "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. If you ask anything in my name, I will do it." And the apostle Paul stated: "There is one God, and one mediator between God and men, a man, Christ Jesus."John 14:6, 14; 1 Timothy 2:5.

*** w80 6/1 18 Praying to Jehovah so as to Be Heard ***
PRAY THROUGH, NOT TO, JESUS CHRIST

How can we gain access to the great "Hearer of prayer"? He has appointed that this be through Jesus Christ alone. There is only one Mediator between God and men, and one High Priest, Jesus Christ. (1 Tim. 2:5; Heb. 7:25, 26) Jesus himself put it very explicitly, saying: "No one comes to the Father except through me." (John 14:6) "Most truly I say to you, If you ask the Father for anything he will give it to you in my name. . . . Ask and you will receive, that your joy may be made full."John 16:23, 24.

*** w75 7/1 405 Coming to the Hearer of Prayer ***
There is also added reason for us to approach such a God in freeness of speech in prayer since learning the part that Christ Jesus plays in this arrangement. The apostle Paul focuses our attention on him in these words at Hebrews 4:15, 16: "For we have as high priest, not one who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who has been tested in all respects like ourselves, but without sin. Let us, therefore, approach with freeness of speech to the throne of undeserved kindness, that we may obtain mercy and find undeserved kindness for help at the right time." Knowing that he underwent the very things we must face and endure, we appreciate how understanding he can be and how helpful to us as we sinful creatures endeavor to be reconciled to God through him as our redeemer and mediator.Heb. 7:25.

*** w74 7/1 396 How the Use of Images Can Affect You ***
What about praying to Jesus earthly mother Mary or to particular saints for them to "intercede" with God on ones behalf? The Bibles direct answer is: "There is only one mediator between God and mankind, himself a man, Christ Jesus."1 Tim. 2:5, Je.

*** w66 8/1 465 Baptism Shows Faith ***
16 The Bible record of Cornelius, an army officer, reveals a man changing from a past course of life and becoming a Christian minister. Acts 10:30-32 tells how his earnest prayers to Jehovah brought angelic response and how Peter was directed to the home. Baptism is rightly performed by dedicated men; so Peter was sent. Of special interest to one wishing to make his dedication to God is the act of faith known as prayer. When one makes his dedication he prays to Jehovah in the name of Jesus Christ, the Son, the Mediator between God and man.

*** w63 1/15 52 The "Good News" Separates 'A People for Jehovah's Name' ***
21 It is a great privilege to be associated with the people for Jehovahs name, for it brings with it the joy of serving the true God. But more important is the relationship entered into with Jehovah God. The one with a good heart, who appreciates the "good news" and has a sincere desire to do the divine will, will want to use his life to the praise of Jehovah. To that end he makes a dedication of his life, making a solemn promise in prayer to Jehovah that from henceforth he will seek, not his own will, but Gods will, just as Jesus did. (Pss. 40:8; 143:10; Luke 22:42; John 5:30) The Christian recognizes that it is by means of the mediator Christ Jesus that he is able to enter into this dedicated relationship with God.See "This Good News of the Kingdom," paragraphs 45-51.

*** w58 8/15 503 Prayer, a Precious Loving Provision ***
RECOGNIZING GODS CHANNEL

 Further, if our prayers are to reach God we must recognize his appointed way, for Jehovah is a God of order. As the great Sovereign of the universe he is not one to permit his subjects to indiscriminately intrude upon him, and especially not such as are his enemies because of sin. He has a channel which we must recognize if we would have an audience with him, as it were. Since the spring of A.D. 33 that channel is Jesus Christ, even as he said: "No one comes to the Father except through me." While many may profess to reach God through Mary or other so-called saints, in this they sadly err; for, look where we will in Gods Word, not once do we read of any petitions being directed through these or of any commands for us to do so. "There is one God, and [only] one mediator between God and men, a man Christ Jesus, who gave himself a corresponding ransom for all." Since this is so, it might be asked, Why did not Jesus include this requirement in the model prayer he gave his disciples? Doubtless because when he gave that prayer he had not fully proved himself. But by the last day of his ministry he had finished the work his Father had given him to do, and so he could say: "If you ask the Father for anything he will give it to you in my name. Until this present time you have not asked a single thing in my name. Ask and you will receive, that your joy may be made full."John 14:6; 1 Tim. 2:5, 6; John 17:4; 16:23, 24.

*** w57 4/15 238 When All Men Again Worship One God ***
Then to show there is only one right form of worship and only one way to the one true God, Jesus said to his followers: "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but by me." (John 14:6, RS) The reason why Jesus said this was that he had come here to be the go-between or mediator between Jehovah God and men. Under divine inspiration the apostle Paul declares: "There is one God, and one mediator between God and men, a man Christ Jesus, who gave himself a corresponding ransom for all." (1 Tim. 2:5, 6, NW) Being a perfect man on earth and dying sinless as a martyr for Gods kingdom, Christ Jesus offered to God the one acceptable ransom sacrifice for the sins of mankind. So he alone can serve as mediator.

*** w54 10/15 622 Why Prayers Go Unanswered ***
Now what does it mean to pray in the right manner? First of all it means to approach Jehovah in the name of Christ Jesus, who the Bible says is the "one mediator between God and men." So can one expect an answer to his prayer if he does not ask it in Jesus name? Said the Son of God himself: "No one comes to the Father except through me." Since Christ is the only mediator, the "one mediator," there can be no more mediators between God and men. Hence, praying to Jehovah in the name of some "saint" or the mother of Jesus is unscriptural. It is praying in the wrong manner. The right manner is explained by Jesus: "If you ask anything in my name, I will do it."1 Tim. 2:5; John 14:6, 14, NW.

*** g83 12/8 12 The Pope's Message-Is It the Answer? ***
Jesus urged his followers to pray for that Kingdom to come when he counseled: "You must pray, then, this way: Our Father in the heavens, let your name be sanctified. Let your kingdom come. Let your will take place, as in heaven, also upon earth." Did Jesus say that his followers should request Gods Kingdom through his mother, Mary? His own answer is: "Also, whatever it is that you ask in my name, I will do this, in order that the Father may be glorified in connection with the Son [not the mother]. If you ask anything in my name, I will do it." Clearly, Christ is the sole Mediator between God and man, even as the apostle Paul affirmed: "For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, a man, Christ Jesus."Matthew 6:9, 10; John 14:13, 14; 1 Timothy 2:5.

*** g75 1/22 28 Can Saints Help You? ***
How, then, should a Christians prayers be directed to God in order to be acceptable to him? Jesus Christ pointedly said: "I am the Way, the Truth and the Life. No one can come to the Father except through me. If you ask for anything in my name, I will do it." (John 14:6, 14, The Jerusalem Bible) Now as a resurrected and exalted spirit creature, "Jesus continues for ever, and his priestly office is unchanging; that is why he can give eternal salvation to those who through him make their way to God; he lives on still to make intercession on our behalf." (Heb. 7:24, 25, Knox) Additionally, Paul wrote: "For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus."1 Tim. 2:5, Revised Standard Version, Catholic Edition.

*** g74 1/8 10 What Do You Know About Prayer? ***
To be acceptable to God, prayers must be through the channel he recognizes. Jesus said: "No one comes to the Father except through me." Jesus also said prayers should be presented in his name. (John 14:6; 16:23) Thus, our prayers should acknowledge that the value of the sacrifice of Jesus own human life makes it possible for us to approach God in prayer, and that there is just "one mediator between God and men, a man, Christ Jesus."1 Tim. 2:5.

 

 

Blondie,

They're skilled at arguing for two opposite positions simultaneously!!!!

Cheers, Ozzie

Oz

Help me out if I'm wrong but isn't Jesus according to WT theology, the medeator of the 144,000 ONLY?   And that the Governing Body is the medeator between God and the JW's?  So according to WT theology Jesus is NOT your medeator but just the medeator of the 144,000?

 

 

jr

Oh dear JR! Perhaps you should re-read my original post, but the short answer is, you are quite correct!

That's my point, ya see! If those offering congregational prayer are of the GC, how can they share in saying Amen to a prayer that is through someone who is NOT their mediator.

Yeah, I know, I'm being precious, but then, the Borg mentality brings it on with their legalism and outright bizarre teaching.

Cheers, Ozzie

Yes, JR, they teach that too.  The point here is that the WTS teaches that all people must pray through Jesus only, not saints or Mary, and they base this on 1 Timothy 2:5 where it says Jesus is the only mediator and thus he is the only one we can pray through.  If Jesus is only the mediator for 144,000, then who do the rest of mankind pray through?

*** w97 2/15 28 Agreement Between "God's Temple" and Idols in Greece? ***
Furthermore, in a very clear way, the Scriptures rule out the idea of praying to "saints" in order for them to act as intercessors with God. In his model prayer, Jesus taught that prayers are to be addressed to the Father only, since he directed his disciples: "You must pray, then, this way: Our Father in the heavens, let your name be sanctified." (Matthew 6:9) Jesus further stated: "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. If you ask anything in my name, I will do it." And the apostle Paul stated: "There is one God, and one mediator between God and men, a man, Christ Jesus."John 14:6, 14; 1 Timothy 2:5.

I understand clearly what your point is, and I can't wait to share this bit of trickery with my JW relatives. It seems no-one but the wt is trying to say that Jesus is not the mediator between man and God. He gives his love and answer to prayer freely to anyone who ask in his name. But the JW's official Watch Tower is the one interpreting this incorrectly as to say that only the 144,000 may recieve Jesus as their mediator and everyone else just gets to tag along. How sad. But then again we are talking about people who deny the diety of christ and therefor can convienantly make him less of importance any time they feel like it. They also refer to the holy spirit as an inactive force. It seems strange that such human responsibilities like comforting and teaching would be attributed to an "inactive force" Not to mention I believe the only sin listed in the bible as unforgivable is blasphemy against the holy spirit. Seems hard to blaspheme against an inactive force.

Blondie (BTW that was a cool band from the late 70's)

I understand your point.....

But why even pray to Jesus or what is the point to praying to Jesus is Jesus is not Really your medeator.  Just the medeator of the 144,000 which most in the organization are not.  And isn't the 144,000 those special super saints starting with the discipels of Jesus' day up untill today with the GB ending with the "last generation at 1914"  if thats so the the last of the GB are old and have one foot in the grave.  This is acourding to WT theology.  Soon there will be no 144,000  (GB from the 1914 era) if thats so there will be know one left to pray to Jesus since Jesus only listens to the 144,000 since he is thier medeator alone.  Think of it it's the year 2020 and acourding to WT theology no one can pray to Jesus any more.  The only way out for the WT is some bogus new light.

 

just a thought,

jr

Edited by - clash_city_rockers on 19 November 2002 22:18:40

I'll never forget my horror at being told Jesus was not MY mediator. I just didn't get it.

My hubby always says the dubs say "in Jesus name", the same way people on walkie talkies say "over and out".

It's so sad.....

according to WT theology after the 144,000 are dead and gone there will be no one left to pray to Jesus.  Where will be your hope.... who will listen.....

 

The good news is that anyone who places thier trust on Jesus for salvation then Jesus will always be his or her  medeator....

 

there is hope and it is found in Jesus........

jr

Edited by - clash_city_rockers on 20 November 2002 0:12:35

Maybe so, JR, but please learn to spell Mediator correctly!

The Society's mediator beliefs are even more bizarre when you consider that they also teach that the "anointed" are "declared righteous" before being taken into the New Covenant. If the purpose of this is that they can be viewed as "sinless" in God's eyes so that they can be taken into that covenant, why would they then require a mediator, Christ Jesus? Isn't a mediator needed because righteous God is on the one side and "imperfect" people on the other?

Edited by - cyberguy on 28 November 2002 13:13:28