First let me say this.

I have constantly been hearing of the legendary honesty/intergity of the Jehovah's Witness for some time now. I have also been informed that they are the happiest people on the entire earth.

My problem is this:

When a Jehovah's Witness comes to your door and you actually decide to give them a few moments of your time they never give the whole story as to what you would be getting involved with when you join the Watchtower.

Case in point. The last conversation that I had with a JW in feild service was a few weeks ago. While at my door I asked several point blank questions and they either directly lied to me about them or they purposely sidestepped the issues. Two topics that I brought up are as follows,

1) Did your Church predict that the World would end within the region of a few months past 1975?

It is important to note that the lady I asked this question was baptized in 1969! She expected me to believe that there was absolutely no shuch statement ever written in their magazines or at any talk or convention. I simply cannot believe that statement due to the fact that I have too much irrefutable evidence to the contrary.

I know that she was lying.

A second issue was,

2) Do you practise shunning people that have left your church by dissociation or being disfelloshipping.

She refused to give me a direct anwser to my question at first. So I had to ask a series of less significant questions inorder to get her to to reveal more information.

I asked her if you could asociate or even converse with a person who had been disfelloshipped and she replyed with this statement;

" Well just the other day a lady who came from another country visited my Kingdom Hall and she said she was disfelloshipped."

Now this was a statement made with one intention and one intenton alone, which was to decieve. For some reason though I wasent too surprised that she said this but I expected better of her though.

I replied with,

"So how long did you two ladies converse after the moment that she stated that she was disfelloshipped?"

Her reply was

"Well she aksed about the elders"

I persisted in asking

"How long did you talk to the lady after she stated thet she was disfelloshipped?"

She side stepped the question with this reply

"Well we have the elders who deal with those sorts of conversations."

The moral of the story is if I hadent known for a fact that the Jehovah's Witnesses are not allowed to associate or even speak to their disassociatted or disfelloshipped individuals that she would have convinced me that being labeled disfellshipped or disassociated was nothing but a trivial matter.

But the truth of the matter is that after you have been baptized as a Jehovah's Witness and you decide to lave the organisation or are disfelloshipped ( given the boot ) that you will most likely loose all your friends and family who remain Jehovah's Witnesses. Since you are incouraged not to associate with non-Witnesses you will have pratically no friends.

Levaing the organisation after you have ben baptized could destroy your entire life as you had known it. There is no error where that statement is concerned.

If I was ever in doubt that the Witnesses utilize decptive recruting tacktics the conversation I had with a mature Witness in feild service confirmed my information for good. I think that she would have realized forshure that I knew more about the Watchtower than the average house holder but that did not sway her to refrain from lying. Ifact I think that she saw me as an agent of satan which would havegiven her evenmore reason to le to me.

At this point I would like to pose a few questions to anyone wiling to anwser.

While you were a Witness were you informed about the usage of spritual warfare? If so then how often did you use it especially while in feild service?

It is because of matters like this that I truly believe that the Watchtower organisation is a menace to society. Since in my opinion most recruits would have no idea of what they are becoming involved with. They would not know that they would be expected to give up their past aquaintances, endure the 3 meetings a week, put up with any ostracism that they may recieve from the congragation, increase their chances of suffering from mential depression, pedal Watchtower literature on a regular basis, refuse life saving transfusions, and basically give up to question authority of the ones controlling your life. This is but a short list of what one is required to give up as a baptised Witness.

It just isnt fair for someone to have to get involved with an organisation shuch as the Watchtower without knowing the whole story.

It is a pity that the Witnesses themselves who have been involved with the organisation for several years dont even know the whole story themselves. Yet they presist in deciving house holders inorder to recruit them into the Watchtower.

This has to be the Ultimate irony.

jerome

SS

I would like to konw (if you wouldent mind) if you yourself actually had to lie to somebody while in feild service or to a study.

jerome

I don't mind at all. I told the standard wt lies. I tried to argue that it was never proven that a jw died from lack of blood transfusion. I tried to show that all that was needed was a volume expander like saline solution, and that there were enough red cells to keep the jw alive if the volume was up. I argued that the body continuoussly prduces red cells.

I argued that when john1:1 says that jesus was god, it didn't really mean what it said.

I argued that when jesus said that he would raise his body that they killed, back up after three days, that he didn't really mean his physical body.

I argued that when somebody was dfd, it was their own fault for deliberately doing something like smoking, sex, disagreeing w the wt.

I remember preaching to the other kids in school that the end would come in 1975, or there abouts. I remember someone saying to me that he would like to talk to me in 1976, to show me i was wrong.

I hardly ever was able to live a perfect jw life. Yet i preached to others that they should become jws. This was especially so when i was in my teens. Back then i used to drink and sometimes attempt to get to know non-jw girls. For a while i smoked. Masterbation was something i was guilty of all the time, except for about 5 yrs, during which time i managed to stop, but i develped an ulcer.

I was depressed most of the time. Yet we were told that we were the happiest people on earth. I was on antidepressant meds twice.

Really, i think i am more honest now. I have more integrity now. That means i'm more together. I know more what i am, and can accept what i am. I don't have to pretend. I don't need to deny what i am. That's integrity. When i look back at my life as a jw, it was a sad pantomime. But that's okay, because it was part of growing.

SS

Jerome,

Yes, I was taught to use tact. That meant being as evasive as possible so as not to answer a question, but appear that you did. After awile, that skill becomes second nature.

We also engaged in role plays in the service meeting, where we practiced how to over come objections. These were sessions where we practiced these evasive tactics.

LOL @ jerome.

Very observant assessment.

It is not religious persecution for an informed person to expose publicly a certain religion as being false, thus allowing persons to see the difference between false religion and true religion.
WT 11/15/1963 page 688 paragraph 3

How often do they talk about this Theocratic War Stragety at meetings?

The same lady came back with her daughter the next sunday.

At the end of that conversation I asked her point blank if she knew what theocratic war stragety was but instead of anwsering the question she just laughed. And her daughter did the same.

But even after revealing all that I knew I still got a third return visit. This one was only for a few minuted though. She (the daughter) came back last sunday for some information about the UN scandal.
She read the print outs I gave her and started to laugh half way through.

Jerome, I'm curious, you said you are from a 3rd world country, no? If so, are the people calling on you native to your country, or missionaries? You may have already givin these details, but if so I missed them. Thanks.

I think the reason that the person laughed half way through the UN material, is because reading it made her very nervous, and she couldn't give an intelligent reply to what you showed her.

jerome-

You said:
I do not believe I have ever heard this so eloquently phrased.

I can say personally I have helped 2 "born and raised" JW make an exit using the UN scandal as the initial conversation piece.

It may not appear so blatantly to the naked eye yet, but the WTS is in serious trouble. The older generation unwilling to stare reality in the face are dying off, and the young breed are exiting handfuls at a time.

It is not religious persecution for an informed person to expose publicly a certain religion as being false, thus allowing persons to see the difference between false religion and true religion.
WT 11/15/1963 page 688 paragraph 3

Both were childhood friends from my former congregation who remained JW in name, and although committing fornication and every other young adult sin... still believed the JW doctrine. Both ironically are sons of current elders.

The most important point is they were open to possibilities.

Once I showed them the UN scandal and gave them the documents in hand.. then from there proceeded with old bound volumes and contradictions on organ transplants, shunning, rape, blood, generation, Russell gravesite, etc... the floodgates were opened and they DA very quickly.

My case is only one of many. Silently and unadmittingly, the numbers are waning and fast.

The "15 minute" arrangement and the new procedure of the PO collecting time slips instead of the field service box are testament to this.

The WTBTS is desperate not to report decreases, especially in the country where the "WORLD HEADQUARTERS" of "GODS ONLY TRUE ORGANIZATION" is located.

To the WT official who most likely monitors this site, because you HAVE to have knowledge of your opponent in order to survive... you are going down. Each individual can make a difference, and I have encouraged the people I helped make an exit to try with all their might to help someone they know to make an exit. The numbers multiply.

The WTS will be radically changed to mainstream or nonexistent in my lifetime. With so many screw-ups so readily available in documentation to prove this.. they have no choice.

It is not religious persecution for an informed person to expose publicly a certain religion as being false, thus allowing persons to see the difference between false religion and true religion.
WT 11/15/1963 page 688 paragraph 3