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Must obey!Watchtower says JW's can reach different conclusions & it's fine!!!


The Watchtower study article "Responding to Your Conscience" (October 15, 2007, pages 25-29, studied December 3-9, 2007) dealing with, inter alia, oral sex, contained what I thought was an interesting new way of describing how JW's can form their own personal, and different, conclusions and that no one needs to be 'disturbed' by this.  I have never seen the Watchtower describe it quite this way, even in relation to conscience matters like whether to attend a church wedding.  What was particuarly interesting was the wording of this question Q13) Why need it not be disturbing that two Christians reach different conclusions?. 

This question seems to be worded in this way out of silent consideration for the fact that what the Authoritarian Watchtower Society prizes above all else, is UNITY OF BELIEF.  Unity of belief is prized and sustained even above truth itself because some the GB most certainly know that certain of the Society's interpretations are flawed and false.  That is why it is normally so DISTURBING for JW's to "reach different conclusions" on things.

What is interesting is the thinking coming through in paragraphs 11-13.  What we see in those paragraphs is in fact the correct way that the Society should be treating many of its interpretations.  Where there are very good reasons that can be argued BOTH WAYS, the only logical and proper stance for the Watchtower to take is to let each Christian make up their own mind, based on their own conscientious research and conclusions!  In this example given, both sisters went away and did personal research (unfortuantely to be restricted to the Society's own publications - a point strongly alluded to in para 12) and both formed different conclusions about the SAME MATTER from their research, and based on their own personal circumstances.  How often have we seen the Society present such a balanced and reasonable position???

Sadly, the Watchtower only allows this moderate stance in the most greyest of grey areas.  As para 4 in this study article strongly implies, it is wrong for JW's to ever disagree with the Governing Body on matters of doctrine and even the smallest of interpretations the Society has put forward as being the true scriptural position must never be questioned.  This authoritarian stance is completely unnaceptable.  In contrast to that, the Society has unwittingly declared in these paragraphs 11 to 13 of this study article the exact attitude it needs to adopt with a whole raft of teachings for which good scriptural arguments can be presented both for and against (and in fact, for which the opposing arguments to their position are indeed much stronger). 

In a nutshell, allowing each Christian to form their own conclusions on NEARLY EVERYTHING is what the Society should be doing, but within a certain minimum range of basic doctrine (notice that the apostles & older men in Jerusalem, the first century so-called "governing body" the Society mentions in paragraph 4, say that they holy spirit only expects the congregations to adhere to "these necessary things" - so only a few things need to be insisted upon by the Governing Body today!!).  For example, since there is so much evidence against the 1914 chronology being correct, the Society should humbly announce "there are good reasons and arguments that can be presented both ways...it is not up to us to tell you what you must believe on this matter.....do your own research and come to your own conclusions and tolerate each others conclusions....there is no need to be disturbed by this at all!"  This approach, the approach set out in paragraphs 11-13 in the examples of two sisters faced with the same choice, is EXACTLY the approach they should be taking with a huge range of their debateable interpretations!  What a pity it seems that will never happen in the organisation except for inconsequential so-called "conscience matters" like attending a church wedding.

Here are paragraphs in the articles:

 

Q11) Describe how one Christian wife might reason on whether to attend a church wedding, leading to what conclusion?

11) Lois reflects on the serious Bible command, `Get out of Babylon the Great,' the world empire of false religion. (Revelation 18:2, 4) She once belonged to the church where the wedding is to take place and knows that during the ceremony all present will be asked to share in religious acts, such as prayer, singing, or religious gestures. She is determined to have no part in that and does not want even to be there and be under pressure to break her integrity. Lois respects her husband and wants to cooperate with him, her Scriptural head; yet, she does not want to compromise her Scriptural principles. (Acts 5:29) Hence, she tactfully explains to her mate that even if he chooses to be there, she personally cannot. She may mention that if she attended and refused to share in some act, it might cause him embarrassment, so in that sense her not attending might be best for him. Her decision leaves her with a clear conscience.

[Picture on page 28] Two Christians facing a similar situation might make different decisions [Husband and wife discuss invitation. Husband has goatee (non-JW); wife holds up hands objecting. Picture represents scenario in paragraph 11.]

Q12) How might someone reason on and react to an invitation to a wedding in a church?

12) Ruth faces virtually the same dilemma. She respects her husband, is resolved to be loyal to God, and is responsive to her Bible-trained conscience. After thinking about points such as the ones Lois considered, Ruth prayerfully consults "Questions From Readers" in The Watchtower of May 15, 2002. She remembers that the three Hebrews complied with a command to be where idolatry would occur, yet they kept their integrity by not sharing in an idolatrous act. (Daniel 3:15-18) She decides to accompany her husband but not to share in any religious deeds, and she is acting in harmony with her conscience. She tactfully but clearly explains to her husband what her conscience will permit her to do and what she cannot do. Ruth hopes that he will see the difference between true worship and false.-Acts 24:16.

Q13) Why need it not be disturbing that two Christians reach different conclusions?

13) Does the fact that two Christians might reach different conclusions suggest that it makes no difference what a person does or that one of these two must have a weak conscience? No. In view of her past experience with the music and trappings of church ceremonies, Lois may sense that being present would be particularly dangerous for her. And her past interactions with her husband on religious issues may affect her conscience. So she is convinced that her decision is best for her.

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oompaRe: Watchtower says JW's can reach different conclusions & it's fine!!!

Man what a great well written post!  I can't wait to cut and paste it an email to my dad who has been conducting the watchtower for 25 years!

very well done is all I have to add......................oompa

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wednesdayRe: Watchtower says JW's can reach different conclusions & it's fine!!!

If the WTs ever did what the Church of God did, ( a religion that had some very similar beliefs to jws and whose leader was often thought to be an apostate, but he wasn't) ie renounce their beliefs , acknowledge they had hurt many, and make necessary corrections--I  could have some respect for them. As it is, they are just another lying religion, and no better than the Jim Jones crowd.

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shopaholicRe: Watchtower says JW's can reach different conclusions & it's fine!!!
Its fine unless most people in your congregation or your BOE disagrees with you.
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llbhRe: Watchtower says JW's can reach different conclusions & it's fine!!!

Interesting and lucid post Must Obey.

What you say about 1914 and by extrapolation many other doctrines is spot on. How many here would still be in if they were a little more flexible? I do not want to go there

How sad that they do not value genuine and passionate debate.

Enjoyed your musing

llbh.

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avishaiRe: Watchtower says JW's can reach different conclusions & it's fine!!!
Its fine unless most people in your congregation or your BOE disagrees with you.
Amen..
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OdradeRe: Watchtower says JW's can reach different conclusions & it's fine!!!
Two + two = five.

Excellent post.
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momzcrazyRe: Watchtower says JW's can reach different conclusions & it's fine!!!

I'm sorry, but all I have ever heard is "If we want your opinion, we'll tell you what it is". I have actually found other similar articles from past Watchtowers, but if you read C of C you'll know the truth.

momz

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bigmouthRe: Watchtower says JW's can reach different conclusions & it's fine!!!
I think you've made a well considered observation mustobey and the use of 'disturbed' in this context I've not seen before.

But The Watchtower Society are experts at the use of subtlety and shades of meaning with the words they use,

I see no actual change of view in reality from what they've ever had.

Many of us will remember the article using the illustration of the brother who was contracted to paint a church door. (1980's) His conscience might or might not allow him to do it but would he stumble another who observed him painting it. The 'strong' Witnesses agreed they wouldn't do it.

The Society is starting to give the outward appearance of being less strict so as to avoid future litigation.

A crack has been opened somewhere and the lawyers are flat out patching it.
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nomoreguiltRe: Watchtower says JW's can reach different conclusions & it's fine!!!

We need to sign this guy up with a contract. Must Obey, you have a great hand here, keep it up.

nomoreguilt

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Bonnie_ClydeRe: Watchtower says JW's can reach different conclusions & it's fine!!!
Lois reflects on the serious Bible command, `Get out of Babylon the Great,' the world empire of false religion. (Revelation 18:2, 4) She once belonged to the church where the wedding is to take place and knows that during the ceremony all present will be asked to share in religious acts, such as prayer, singing, or religious gestures. She is determined to have no part in that and does not want even to be there and be under pressure to break her integrity. Lois respects her husband and wants to cooperate with him, her Scriptural head; yet, she does not want to compromise her Scriptural principles.

This situation came up with a friend of Clyde's who attends meetings with his wife of 43 years--only this time it was a funeral.  She read this WT article and decided to be like Lois and not attend.  Clyde's friend is really ticked.  I don't see how this is showing "respect" to her husband.  He has shown her "respect" by attending the Kingdom Hall these last 43 years, but she won't attend the funeral of their friend because it's in a church. 

The Watchtower continues to devise ways to break down marriages.

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minimusRe: Watchtower says JW's can reach different conclusions & it's fine!!!

Remember, the WT. states one thing but in personal correspondence to elders they say the opposite.

The WT. states you can vote. The Circuit Overseer tells the elders, "ignore that. It only applies in some foreign countries".

The WT. states you will not be disfellowshipped for accepting a blood transfusion but they tell elders that the action could simply mean that the person himself, disassociated from the Christian Congregation by his actions.

The WT. states that the elders should clearly extend mercy to those that are in judicial hearings. The CO tells the elders, "Now everyone is extending too much mercy. We'd rather you judge (and err) on the side of justice than mercy. We don't people to contaminate the Organization".

So, the WT. can spin or say anything they like. It means nothing.

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yknotRe: Watchtower says JW's can reach different conclusions & it's fine!!!

Umm this was all under the guise of headship to an unbelieving husband. 

If the WTS outright says to disregard her husbands headship (authority), then what is the difference in disregarding the FDS self-given authority?......

The only conclusion that made this fine was the wife being in subject to her non-JW hubby.

****of course I know this tatic well******** as my hubby is not a Witness*******

(BTW if the Hubby was a JW and his wife was not and had wanted him to attend, the answer should/'would have had to be NO)

Ahhhh reverse sexism.....a rarely seen sight.

Y

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flipperRe: Watchtower says JW's can reach different conclusions & it's fine!!!
MUST OBEY- Very good thread . Really well done by you.Well, all I can say is it certainly doesn't surprise me, the double  talk and confusing takes on what one person's concsience will allow as compared to what another persons concsience will allow !  Is it any wonder these people and this organization is so messed up in relation to what is allowed and what is not ? The flip flops in the view of oral sex over the years, hell even their policy on child abuse has continually flip-flopped depending on what congregation or elder body was dealing with each particular case !  This was a big reason I got out of the witnesses, because one elder would tell you one thing, another would say something different .  Then, when I would go back and do research myself, I'd find out both were wrong and not doing things according to how the governing body instructed ! That's when I through my hands up, and walked away, never going back. They were all full of $hit !   Peace out, Mr. Flipper
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AllTimeJeffRe: Re: Watchtower says JW's can reach different conclusions & it's fine!!!

It's my opinion that they put statements in their as is found in paragraph 13 just in case they need to quote something later in the press. They won't point to the decades of rules. They will point to this WT quote and say "See? We encourage people to think for themselves, except in cases where the bible clearly condemns a certain course of conduct." (I have heard this line of reasoning so much it makes me ill to type it right now...)

This is a cover their @$$ quote. I find it ironic that the article sort of contradicts this statement throughout....

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WTWizardRe: Watchtower says JW's can reach different conclusions & it's fine!!!

OK, so I have reached the conclusion that Jehovah is nothing more than a baghead that makes promises He knows He will not keep, japs on them every time, and then has the nerve to order me to act as if He had kept them anyways.  I wonder how the Watchtower Society will react to that--maybe that is fine, too.

It had better be, since that is the conclusion I have reached.

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blondieRe: Watchtower says JW's can reach different conclusions & it's fine!!!

Remember that insisting on your own conscience but stumbling another is the most important point according to the WTS.  So even if your conscience allows something, if it disturbs that of another jw perhaps stumbling them you are to set aside your conscience.

*** w06 3/15 pp. 24-25 par. 15 "Each One Will Carry His Own Load" ***Often, the choices we make affect others, and we need to give consideration to this. The first-century Christians, for example, were no longer under many of the dietary restrictions of the Mosaic Law. They could choose to eat certain foods that were considered unclean under the Law and were not objectionable in other ways. However, the apostle Paul wrote about meat of an animal that might have some link with an idol temple: "If food makes my brother stumble, I will never again eat flesh at all, that I may not make my brother stumble." (1 Corinthians 8:11-13) The early Christians were encouraged to show consideration for the consciences of others so as not to stumble them. Our decisions should not make us "causes for stumbling."—1 Corinthians 10:29, 32.
*** w05 4/1 p. 29 Questions From Readers ***Above all, he should pursue a course that leaves him with a good conscience, that brings no reproach on Jehovah’s name, and that does not stumble others.—Matthew 6:9; 1 Corinthians 10:31-33; 2 Corinthians 6:3; 1 Timothy 1:5.

*** w99 4/15 p. 29 Questions From Readers ***

What
istheeffectofdoingthework;willithurtone’sownconscienceorstumbleothers? Conscience should be considered, both our own and that of others. Even if a certain work (including its location and source of pay) seems acceptable to most Christians, an individual may sense that it would trouble his personal conscience. The apostle Paul, who set a fine example, stated: "We trust we have an honest conscience, as we wish to conduct ourselves honestly in all things." (Hebrews 13:18) We ought to avoid doing work that would leave us disturbed; yet, we also should not be critical of others whose consciences differ. Conversely, a Christian might see no conflict with the Bible in his doing a certain work, but he realizes that it would be very disturbing to many in the congregation and in the community. Paul reflected the right attitude in his words: "In no way are we giving any cause for stumbling, that our ministry might not be found fault with; but in every way we recommend ourselves as God’s ministers."—2 Corinthians 6:3, 4.

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DaCheechRe: Watchtower says JW's can reach different conclusions & it's fine!!!

the problem is that some people will tell the elders EVERYTHING.

some MS in my area was just ratted by his own sister!

I DONT tell anyone in my congo private matters.

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mosheRe: Watchtower says JW's can reach different conclusions & it's fine!!!
They can't let this very far or a free for all will break out in the KH amongst the brothers.
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DaCheechRe: Watchtower says JW's can reach different conclusions & it's fine!!!
there is a certain something that happened to me personally (as far as witness stuff goes) that I cannot even tell people on this board for the fear of some brothers knowing who I am
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